Unrefined Podcast .com

Forgiveness is one of the most necessary parts of the Christian life, but it is also one of the most misunderstood. In this episode, Brandon and Sandy sit down with Dr. Everett Worthington to talk about what forgiveness actually is, what it is not, and why reconciliation is something different altogether. Dr. Worthington shares the tragic story of his mother’s murder and how that moment forced him to live out the very forgiveness he had spent years studying and teaching. The conversation explores decisional forgiveness, emotional forgiveness, rumination, resentment, justice, boundaries, and what happens inside us when unforgiveness takes root. Dr. Worthington also walks through his REACH model and offers practical help for those who feel stuck in pain, anger, or grief. This is a powerful, honest, and hope-filled conversation for anyone wrestling with what it means to forgive without pretending the wound never happened.
Ev's Book https://a.co/d/01UMgKXo
Ev's Website -https://www.evworthington-forgiveness.com/
Timestamps
00:08 Forgiveness and reconciliation are not the same thing
00:28 Welcome to the Unrefined Podcast
00:51 Introducing Dr. Everett Worthington and the topic of forgiveness
03:13 Dr. Worthington’s early work studying forgiveness
05:36 The murder of Dr. Worthington’s mother
07:41 Wrestling with anger after tragedy
10:06 Realizing he had to face forgiveness personally
12:29 Forgiveness does not erase justice
14:56 Defining forgiveness through stress and coping
17:12 Understanding the injustice gap
19:37 Different biblical ways to respond to injustice
21:57 Decisional forgiveness and emotional forgiveness
24:17 Restraint, the brain, and choosing not to retaliate
26:41 The difference between forgiveness and reconciliation
29:00 Boundaries, toxic relationships, and reconciliation
30:22 What it means to love your enemy
32:50 The REACH model of forgiveness
35:12 Giving the gift of forgiveness
37:32 When hurt comes back after forgiving
39:51 Anger, fear, and the body’s protective response
42:14 Rumination and unforgiveness
44:35 Vengeance, grudge-holding, and gender differences
47:02 Decisional forgiveness, emotional forgiveness, and well-being
49:07 Matthew 6 and “forgive to be forgiven”
51:25 Forgiveness, salvation, and God’s judgment
53:51 A word for listeners carrying deep wounds
55:36 Practicing forgiveness over time

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What if your family patterns, addictions, fears, and trauma are not the final word? In this episode, Brandon and team talk with Dr. Luman Wing about epigenetics, transgenerational sin, addiction, sanctification, and how the gospel may reach even deeper into our embodied lives than most Christians have imagined.
https://amzn.to/3QR8z3H- Dr. Lu's book
https://lumanwing.org/
Timestamps:
01:00 Introducing Dr. Luman Wing and Genes of Eden
03:00 Lu’s encounter with the Jesus Movement and Lonnie Frisbee
05:00 Science, design, and Dean Kenyon’s classroom moment
07:00 Blood, biochemistry, biotechnology, and gene therapy
08:00 How theology and epigenetics came together
09:00 Epigenetics explained in plain English
12:00 Stress, fear, habits, prayer, and gene expression
13:00 Augustine, Pelagianism, and inherited sin
15:00 Adam, shame, fear, and the transgenerational imprint
17:00 Transformation, neuroplasticity, and becoming new creatures
19:00 Addiction, dopamine, anticipation, and “holy wanting”
21:00 Why Leviticus may be more scientific than we think
23:00 The peace offering, adrenal glands, stress, and surrender
25:00 Heart, mind, soul, brain, and the emotional response
27:00 The amygdala, hippocampus, and prefrontal cortex
31:00 Traducianism, the soul, and inherited human brokenness
34:00 Junk DNA, non-coding RNA, and the mystery of the soul
36:00 Being born again and the mystery of redemption
39:00 Does salvation change us epigenetically?
41:00 Romans 7, Romans 8, and progressive sanctification
44:00 The worm, the butterfly, and imaginal cells
46:00 Trauma, PTSD, the amygdala, and getting stuck in loops
48:00 Reason, revelation, Scripture, and renewing the mind
50:00 Stillness with God as a real mental workout
53:00 Exercise, swimming, bilateral movement, and healing patterns
54:00 Generational curses, inherited patterns, and epigenetics
55:00 Holocaust trauma and transgenerational imprinting
58:00 Forgiveness as a powerful interruptor of inherited trauma
01:00:00 Addiction, family patterns, and why DNA is not destiny
01:03:00 Trauma in family history and what may carry forward
01:05:00 Why there is no single “alcoholism gene”
01:07:00 Practically learning stillness, peace, and emotional regulation
01:09:00 Why Christian fellowship matters biologically and spiritually
01:10:00 Identity, becoming, and Dr. Wing’s next book
01:12:00 Potential, formation, consolidation, and identity
01:16:00 Leviticus, burnt offerings, and absolute surrender
01:18:00 Why science “screams” the glory of God
01:19:00 Lu’s personal testimony of trauma and God’s intervention
01:21:00 Hope for believers stuck in family patterns

Every once in a while, we revisit an older conversation and realize that it may be even more relevant today than when we first recorded it. That is exactly how I feel about this episode with Nathan Zieber, a pastor, former private investigator, and former investigator with MUFON Canada. Nathan has been called the “Paranormal Pastor” because of his willingness to enter communities that many Christians either fear, dismiss, or simply do not understand.

TIMESTAMPS
00:00 Rewinding a Conversation That Still Matters
02:00 How MUFON Investigates UFO Reports
05:00 From Bible School to Paranormal Investigation
08:00 Christians in Supernatural and Justice Communities
10:00 Why the Church Avoids Paranormal Conversations
11:00 Are Aliens Extraterrestrial or Interdimensional?
14:00 Developing a Heart for People on the Fringe
16:00 When UFO Culture Becomes a Religion
17:00 UFO Disclosure, UAPs, and Possible Smokescreens
21:00 Using UFO Conversations to Open Gospel Doors
24:00 Salvations Within the Paranormal Community
26:00 Why Spiritually Curious People Need Compassion
29:00 Discipleship, Patience, and Messy Transformation
31:00 UFOs, Eschatology, and the Last Days
33:00 CE5, Summoning UFOs, and False Saviors
36:00 Transhumanism, DNA, and the Mark of the Beast
39:00 Investigating a Mysterious Cattle Mutilation
43:00 Nathan’s Terrifying Shadow Encounter
45:00 The Name of Jesus and Alien Encounters
47:00 How Christians Can Minister on the Fringe
50:00 Jesus Was a Friend of Sinners
52:00 What It Means to Be Naturally Supernatural
53:00 Becoming a Church Made of Small Communities

Most people don’t realize how much of life is driven by what the heart has come to believe. Fear, anxiety, bitterness, peace, hope, and faith are not just passing emotions — they are often connected to deep stories we have accepted as reality.
In this episode, Brandon welcomes back Jennifer Johnson for a deeply honest and practical conversation about trading fear for faith. Jennifer shares the story of a devastating church situation that left her family with financial debt, relational loss, disappointment, and a future that looked nothing like what she had planned.
Website: JJohnsoncoach.com 
 
Timestamps:
03:12 — Fear, Faith, and Responding from Love
05:32 — The Church Crisis That Changed Everything
07:52 — Debt, Betrayal, and Hard Decisions
10:17 — Losing a Father Figure and a Church Family
12:36 — Forgiveness, Integrity, and Being Left Behind
14:57 — When Life Becomes Something You Didn’t Choose
17:19 — Why Spiritual Bypassing Can Hurt
19:41 — The Beliefs Beneath the Thoughts
21:59 — How Beliefs Begin Directing Behavior
24:20 — How to Stop the Pain and Heart Transformation
26:43 — Is Fear the Opposite of Faith?
29:11 — If You Can Fear, You Can Faith
31:22 — Trusting the Promise, Surrendering the Process
33:34 — The Cycle of Thought, Evidence, Emotion, and Belief
35:56 — Looking for Evidence of God’s Goodness
38:21 — Walking Through the Valley Without Fear
40:30 — God’s Discipline as Loving Course Correction
42:58 — Hope, Faith, and Choosing Where to Look
45:21 — Learning to Trust the One Who Catches You
47:47 — Faith Is Substance, Not Denial
50:09 — Practical Heart Meditation Begins
52:22 — Letting Jesus Lead the Heart
54:50 — Chosen Before the Foundation of the World
56:56 — Receiving a New Name
58:55 — Remembering You Are on His Team
01:00:56 — Choosing a New Inner Reality
01:03:07 — Faith Instead of Fear
01:04:27 — Simple, But Not Easy
01:05:10 — Jennifer’s Coaching and Meditation Mondays

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In this episode, Brandon, Lindsy and Heard welcome author and researcher Ryan Pitterson for a wild but Scripture-centered conversation on artificial intelligence, ancient rebellion, and the war over humanity.
Ryan is known for his work on the Nephilim, Genesis 6, biblical prophecy, and the supernatural worldview of Scripture. 
The conversation begins with Ryan sharing his story, from growing up in New York City and pursuing law and politics, to being awakened to Bible prophecy and eventually writing on the Nephilim. From there, the episode moves into Genesis, Revelation, AI, transhumanism, the image of the beast, the mark, Babel, and the danger of technology becoming a counterfeit discipler.
Ryan asserts that the Bible gives us patterns, and that what happened in the beginning often foreshadows what comes at the end. He connects the corruption of the image of God in Genesis 6 with modern attempts to redefine humanity through technology, artificial intelligence, genetic manipulation, and spiritual deception.
The episode gets practical. Brandon asks how believers should use AI without being discipled by it. Ryan talks about discernment, boundaries, and the difference between using AI as a tool and turning to it for guidance, identity, intimacy, or spiritual direction.
This is not a fear-based episode. It is a call to stay awake, stay grounded in Christ, walk in love, and recognize that the gospel is still the answer in a world racing toward counterfeit immortality, counterfeit wisdom, and counterfeit salvation.
Links to books:
Judgment of the Nephilim
 The Final Nephilim
 The Earth Before Adam

Timestamps:
00:00:51 Brandon introduces AI as a possible ancient pattern repeating
00:03:11 Ryan Pitterson shares his background and spiritual upbringing
00:05:33 How end-times ministry and Genesis 6 changed Ryan’s direction
00:07:54 The preparation for Christ and the preparation for Antichrist
00:10:24 Ryan introduces The Earth Before Adam and quantum repetition
00:12:36 Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 and the possibility of an ancient judgment
00:14:55 The Hebrew word hayah and the idea that the earth became void
00:17:17 Jeremiah 4 and Ryan’s case for a pre-Adamic judgment
00:19:39 Lucifer’s throne commerce and ancient civilization
00:22:02 AI as a repeat of ancient technology and spiritual rebellion
00:24:22 The image of the beast surveillance worship and compliance