The Urban Farm Podcast with Greg Peterson

With Host Greg Peterson and Guests Bill McDorman and Rebecca Newburn
Find our monthly Seed Chat at SeedChat.org
In This Podcast: This episode of Seed Chat explores the future of seed sovereignty through two connected lenses: grassroots seed libraries and the global seed banking system. Greg Peterson is joined by Bill McDorman and special guest Rebecca Newburn to examine how communities can steward seeds locally while industrial institutions struggle to preserve crop diversity at scale. Rebecca shares how the seed library movement has grown into a global network and why the next challenge is helping communities “close the loop” by saving and returning seeds. Bill then zooms out to explain the history, promise, and limitations of international seed banks—and why local seed stewardship may be our most resilient path forward.
Key Topics
Seed Library Network
Community seed libraries
Seed saving education
CGIAR international gene banks
Global Crop Diversity Trust
Svalbard Global Seed Vault
GRIN (Genetic Resources Information Network)
Regional seed co-ops
Climate adaptation through seed diversity
Snake River Seed Cooperative
Utopian Seed Project

Key Questions Answered
How do seed libraries actually strengthen local food systems?
Seed libraries give communities free access to seeds while rebuilding the habit of growing, saving, and sharing locally adapted crops. Their long-term value is not just seed distribution, it is creating local resilience through community stewardship and regional seed knowledge.
What makes a seed library successful over time?
The strongest seed libraries are sustained by committed people, clear systems, and community participation. Whether run by one passionate organizer or a collective, successful libraries create pathways for education, local seed donations, and long-term stewardship.
What does it mean to “close the loop” in a seed library?
It means moving beyond simply borrowing and planting seeds. A resilient seed library teaches people how to save seeds, clean them, label them, and return them so the system becomes regenerative instead of extractive.
What is CGIAR and why does it matter?
CGIAR is a global agricultural research network that manages 11 major international gene banks holding hundreds of thousands of seed accessions. These collections preserve crop diversity and serve as a global backup for agriculture, but they are increasingly underfunded and difficult to access.
Why are global seed banks under pressure?
Major seed banks face chronic funding shortages, institutional bottlenecks, and climate-related risks. Even the world’s largest backup systems, including Svalbard, are vulnerable to warming temperatures, infrastructure strain, and political instability.
Why is local seed saving becoming more urgent?
As climate disruption, fertilizer shortages, and industrial fragility intensify, communities will need crops adapted to local conditions. Local seed saving builds food security, preserves biodiversity, and gives communities direct control over future growing conditions.
What role do regional seed companies and seed co-ops play?
Regional seed companies and co-ops bridge the gap between grassroots seed libraries and commercial distribution. They grow regionally adapted seed at scale, distribute locally, and help create more durable seed infrastructure.
Why does Bill argue that “nobody’s coming”?
Bill’s central argument is that communities cannot rely solely on governments, institutions, or global systems to protect seed diversity. The responsibility for preserving and adapting seeds increasingly falls to local growers, seed savers, and regional networks.
Episode Highlights
Rebecca Newburn explains how seed libraries have evolved from a novel idea into a global movement with thousands of community-led seed libraries.
Seed libraries succeed when they move beyond free seed distribution and teach people how to save and return seeds.
Rebecca shares new downloadable “zines” designed to help gardeners plant, save, and return seeds with clear instructions.
Bill outlines how CGIAR’s global gene banks were built to preserve crop diversity but now struggle with access, staffing, and long-term funding.
The Global Crop Diversity Trust still lacks the endowment needed to sustainably maintain major international seed collections.
Bill argues that climate resilience depends on getting seed diversity back into the hands of growers, not just preserving it in vaults.
Regional seed banks and co-ops may offer a more resilient model than centralized institutions alone.
Collaboration—not competition—is framed as the cultural shift needed to rebuild seed resilience at scale.

Resources
Find out about Seed libraries — Seed Library Network
Monthly Seed chat — Urban Farm Seed Chat
Podcast Archive — Urban Farm Podcast
Newsletter — Seed Library Network Substack
Regional Seed Inspiration — Snake River Seed Cooperative
Regional Seed Inspiration — Utopian Seed Project
Visit UrbanFarm.org/982 for the show notes and links on this episode!
Need a little bit of advice or just a feedback on your design for your yard or garden?The Urban Farm Team is offering consults over the phone or zoom. Get the benefits of a personalized garden and yard space analysis without the cost of trip charges. You can chat with Greg to get permaculture based feedback.Click HERE to learn more!*Disclosure: Some of the links in our podcast show notes and blog posts are affiliate links and if you go through them to make a purchase, we will earn a nominal commission at no cost to you. We offer links to items recommended by our podcast guests and guest writers as a service to our audience and these items are not selected because of the commission we receive from your purchases. We know the decision is yours, and whether you decide to buy something is completely up to you.

This Seed Chat explores the growing consolidation of global seed ownership and the implications of patenting life. Farmer Greg and Bill McDorman dive into the history of seed patent law, the rise of corporate control, and the tension between industrial agriculture and traditional seed saving. They highlight global efforts, especially in Europe, to resist seed patents and protect biodiversity. The episode emphasizes seed saving as both a practical skill and a powerful act of resilience and autonomy.
Key Topics
Corporate consolidation of global seed ownership
Seed patenting and intellectual property rights
Supreme Court case Diamond v. Chakrabarty (1980)
Plant Variety Protection Act (PVPA)
Utility patents vs. plant breeder protections
European coalition: No Patents on Seeds
Role of NGOs and international advocacy
Open Source Seed Initiative (OSSI)
Center for Food Safety legal efforts
ETC Group and global seed policy research
Organic Seed Alliance publications
Seed saving as resistance and resilience
Genetic diversity and climate adaptation
Industrial agriculture vs. small-scale seed saving

Key Questions Answered
Who controls the world’s seeds?
A small number of multinational corporations dominate the global seed market, controlling a significant percentage of commercial seed distribution. This concentration is driven by mergers, acquisitions, and patent protections that favor industrial agriculture.
How did seed patenting become legal?
The 1980 Supreme Court ruling in Diamond v. Chakrabarty opened the door for patenting living organisms. This decision enabled utility patents on seeds, allowing companies to claim ownership over genetically modified—and later even conventionally bred—plants.
What was the original compromise to protect seed breeders?
The Plant Variety Protection Act (PVPA) provided a 20-year protection period for breeders while still allowing farmers to save seeds and researchers to use protected varieties. This balance has been eroded by utility patents.
Why are seed patents controversial?
Seed patents restrict farmers from saving seeds and limit other breeders from using patented genetics. This undermines traditional agricultural practices and reduces biodiversity.
What is being done globally to resist seed patents?
Organizations like No Patents on Seeds in Europe mobilize public campaigns, monitor patent filings, and challenge approvals. Coalitions of NGOs are working to influence policy and raise awareness.
What is the Open Source Seed Initiative?
OSSI is a movement that protects seeds from patenting by creating a legal framework that ensures varieties remain freely available for use, breeding, and saving.
Why is seed saving important?
Seed saving preserves genetic diversity, strengthens local food systems, and gives growers autonomy. It’s a foundational practice that has sustained agriculture for over 10,000 years.
Is seed saving difficult?
No—contrary to common belief, seed saving is simple at a small scale. The complexity often associated with it comes from industrial agriculture requirements, not backyard or community gardening.
Episode Highlights
Global seed ownership is increasingly concentrated among a few corporations.
The 1980 Supreme Court ruling enabled the patenting of life forms.
The PVPA once balanced breeder rights with farmer freedoms.
Utility patents now restrict both seed saving and research.
European NGOs have mobilized hundreds of thousands against seed patents.
Seed saving is accessible, resilient, and historically proven.
Genetic diversity is critical for adapting to climate change.
Local seed saving builds community and food sovereignty.

Calls to Action & Resources
Join Live Seed Chats - https://seedchat.org
Learn about seed freedom advocacy - https://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org
Explore open-source seeds - https://osseeds.org
Support legal advocacy - https://www.centerforfoodsafety.org
No Patents On Seeds - https://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/en
Organic Seed Alliance - https://seedalliance.org/
A Guide to Seed Intellectual Property Rights - https://seedalliance.org/publications/a-guide-to-seed-intellectual-property-rights/
Penn Parmenter - https://www.pennandcordsgarden.com/
Seed The Untold Story - https://www.seedthemovie.com
Email Bill at [email protected]


Canada
National Farmers Union - Save Our Seed - https://www.nfu.ca/learn/save-our-seed/
Seed Change - https://weseedchange.org/
etc Group - Research global seed policy — https://www.etcgroup.org

Visit UrbanFarm.org/981 for the show notes and links on this episode!
Need a little bit of advice or just a feedback on your design for your yard or garden?The Urban Farm Team is offering consults over the phone or zoom. Get the benefits of a personalized garden and yard space analysis without the cost of trip charges. You can chat with Greg to get permaculture based feedback.Click HERE to learn more!*Disclosure: Some of the links in our podcast show notes and blog posts are affiliate links and if you go through them to make a purchase, we will earn a nominal commission at no cost to you. We offer links to items recommended by our podcast guests and guest writers as a service to our audience and these items are not selected because of the commission we receive from your purchases. We know the decision is yours, and whether you decide to buy something is completely up to you.

A Rosie On The House Replay
This episode explores practical, low-cost strategies for reusing household gray water to irrigate landscapes. Brad Lancaster shares decades of experience designing regenerative water systems in dryland environments, emphasizing simple gravity-fed solutions over complex infrastructure. The conversation highlights how homeowners can dramatically reduce water use by “stacking functions” and capturing water already on-site. By pairing gray water with rainwater harvesting, households can meet most or all of their irrigation needs.
 Brad Lancaster runs a successful permaculture consulting design and education business in Tucson, Arizona. He's focused on integrated and sustainable approaches to landscape design, planning and living. Growing up in a dryland environment, water harvesting has long been one of his specialties and a true passion. He's the author of the Permaculture Bible for Water Harvesting, Rainwater Harvesting for Drylands and Beyond, Volumes One and Two. And he has just released new color versions, revised and expanded of both of them.
Key Topics
Gray water (definition and household sources)
Difference between gray water and black water
Brad Lancaster (water harvesting expert)
Rainwater harvesting systems
Gravity-fed irrigation design
Soil as a living filtration system
Mulch basins and infiltration strategies
Laundry-to-landscape systems
Outdoor shower gray water reuse
Water conservation in dryland climates
Arizona gray water regulations (13 guidelines)
Soap and detergent impacts (salt vs liquid)
Planting water before plants (design philosophy)
Evapotranspiration and passive cooling

Key Questions Answered
What is gray water and how much of household water does it represent?
Gray water is lightly used water from showers, sinks, bathtubs, and washing machines. It represents a significant portion of household water use—nearly equal to outdoor irrigation demand—making it a major opportunity for reuse.
Is gray water safe to use in the landscape?
Yes, when basic guidelines are followed. Avoid toxins, prevent pooling, and distribute water across multiple areas. Soil biology naturally filters the water, making it safe for fruit trees and many landscape plants.
How can homeowners start using gray water cheaply and easily?
Simple systems like redirecting a washing machine hose or using an outdoor shower can send water directly to plants using gravity. No pumps, tanks, or complex filtration systems are needed.
What soaps and products should be used with gray water systems?
Liquid soaps are preferred over powdered detergents because they contain fewer salt-based fillers. Avoid chlorine bleach and opt for hydrogen peroxide alternatives to protect soil health.
Why shouldn’t gray water be stored in tanks?
Stored gray water quickly turns septic due to organic matter, creating odor and health issues. It’s best used immediately by directing it into soil systems.
How does combining gray water and rainwater maximize impact?
Together, they can meet nearly all irrigation needs for a landscape, especially with low-water-use plants. This reduces reliance on municipal water and increases resilience.
What does “plant the water first” mean?
Design the landscape to capture and infiltrate water using basins and contours before planting. This ensures plants receive consistent moisture naturally.
Where should plants be placed in a water-harvesting landscape?
Higher water-use plants should be placed near water sources like roofs or gray water outlets. Trees should be positioned for shade and cooling benefits, especially on east and west sides of buildings.
Episode Highlights
Gray water is “perennial water”—it flows daily as long as you live in your home
You’ve already paid for this water—reuse it instead of sending it to the sewer
A simple laundry system can irrigate multiple trees by rotating a drain hose
Soil acts as a living sponge and filter, outperforming mechanical systems
Outdoor showers can double as irrigation systems and cooling zones for animals
Avoid overcomplication—gravity systems are cheaper, more reliable, and effective
Capturing both rainwater and gray water can eliminate most irrigation needs
Water harvesting landscapes create cooler microclimates and support biodiversity

Calls to Action & Resources
Brad Lancaster Resources — https://www.harvestingrainwater.com
YouTube Channel — Search “Brad Lancaster water harvesting”
Books — Rainwater Harvesting for Drylands and Beyond (Volumes 1 & 2)
Visit www.UrbanFarm.org/980 for the show notes and links on this episode!
Need a little bit of advice or just a feedback on your design for your yard or garden?The Urban Farm Team is offering consults over the phone or zoom. Get the benefits of a personalized garden and yard space analysis without the cost of trip charges. You can chat with Greg, Janis or Ray to get permaculture based feedback.Click HERE to learn more!
*Disclosure: Some of the links in our podcast show notes and blog posts are affiliate links and if you go through them to make a purchase, we will earn a nominal commission at no cost to you. We offer links to items recommended by our podcast guests and guest writers as a service to our audience and these items are not selected because of the commission we receive from your purchases. We know the decision is yours, and whether you decide to buy something is completely up to you.

In this Episode Christopher Parker shares his lifelong journey into mycology, rooted in growing up in the forests of Western North Carolina and decades of hands-on experience. He explains how fungi underpins life on Earth, drives soil fertility, and plays a critical role in regenerative agriculture. The conversation explores low-tech mushroom cultivation, indigenous ecological knowledge, and how working with fungi can create resilient, localized food systems. Christopher also highlights practical ways to grow mushrooms, restore ecosystems, and build livelihoods rooted in land stewardship.
Our Guest: Christopher Parker is a member of the Eastern Band of Cherokee Indians, he is a farmer, educator, and myco-culture keeper with over 30 years of experience in Indigenous regenerative agriculture and mushroom cultivation. He co-founded The Forest Farmacy, an Indigenous-led mushroom school rooted in the Cherokee homeland of Western North Carolina. Chris teaches applied eco-mycology—weaving traditional forest-tending knowledge with modern cultivation science to heal ecosystems and strengthen food sovereignty. His work centers on low-tech, scalable cultivation that transforms farm and forest byproducts into gourmet and medicinal mushrooms. Through his teaching and mentorship, he helps farmers and land stewards create ecologically sound, culturally rooted, and economically resilient livelihoods.
Key Topics & Entities
Christopher Parker
Indigenous regenerative agriculture
Mushroom cultivation (low-tech and scalable)
Mycology and soil microbiology
Mycorrhizal fungi (ecto & endo)
Food sovereignty and local food systems
Forest farming and ecosystem restoration
Trichoderma and soil regeneration
Korean Natural Farming (KNF)
Biochar and microbial inoculation
Mushroom cultivation on logs and sawdust
The Forest Farmacy
The Mycelial Healer (book)
Radical Mycology (book by Peter McCoy)

Key Questions Answered
Why does fungi matter in soil and regenerative agriculture?
Fungi act as the “underground economy,” moving nutrients, water, and minerals between soil and plants. They unlock nutrients already present in the soil, reducing or eliminating the need for external fertilizers.
Can healthy soil eliminate the need for fertilizers?
Yes. When fungal and microbial life is balanced, natural processes provide nutrients to plants, dramatically reducing inputs and allowing nature to do the heavy lifting.
How do mushrooms actually grow and function?
The visible mushroom is only the fruiting body. Most of the organism exists as mycelium within logs or soil, breaking down organic matter and cycling nutrients.
What is a simple way to start growing mushrooms?
Low-tech methods like inoculating logs, pasteurizing straw, or using simple heat sources can produce mushrooms without expensive equipment.
How can mushroom cultivation support regenerative farming?
Spent mushroom substrates and even contaminated batches can be repurposed to build soil biology, suppress pathogens, and enhance fertility.
What role does observation play in successful growing?
Careful observation of natural systems—like how fungi interact with insects, trees, and decay—reveals cultivation insights that can outperform conventional methods.
What are common failures in mushroom cultivation?
Certain species like maitake and chicken of the woods are difficult to grow on logs using standard methods. Understanding their natural ecology can unlock success.
How can farmers integrate fungi into their systems?
By using local fungi, building soil biology, and incorporating techniques like KNF and biochar inoculation, farmers can regenerate land while producing food.
Episode Highlights
Fungi and bacteria underpin all life on Earth
Mushrooms are just the “fruit”—most life is hidden as mycelium
Healthy soil biology can eliminate fertilizer needs
Low-tech mushroom growing is accessible to anyone
Contaminated mushroom bags can regenerate soil via biochar
Observation of nature led to breakthroughs in cultivation methods
Indigenous knowledge and modern science can work together
Start small, learn deeply, and scale gradually

Calls to Action & Resources
The Forest Farmacy — https://theforestfarmacy.com
Christopher's Book: The Mycelial Healer — Available via Chelsea Green Publishing
Course — Year-long mushroom cultivation program HERE
Christophers Book Recommendation -  Paul Stamets, Growing Gourmet Medicinal Mushrooms and  Radical Mycology by Peter McCoy
Show Notes — https://urbanfarm.org/forestfarmacy
Visit www.urbanfarm.org/ForestFarmacy for the show notes on this episode, and access to our full podcast library!
Need a little bit of advice or just a feedback on your design for your yard or garden?The Urban Farm Team is offering consults over the phone or zoom. Get the benefits of a personalized garden and yard space analysis without the cost of trip charges. You can chat with Greg or choose one of the senior members of our Urban Farm team to get permaculture based feedback.Click HERE to learn more!

*Disclosure: Some of the links in our podcast show notes and blog posts are affiliate links and if you go through them to make a purchase, we will earn a nominal commission at no cost to you. We offer links to items recommended by our podcast guests and guest writers as a service to our audience and these items are not selected because of the commission we receive from your purchases. We know the decision is yours, and whether you decide to buy something is completely up to you.

In this Episode Zach Brooks shares how he transformed a barren cotton field into the thriving Arizona Worm Farm which is now one of the largest worm composting operations in the U.S. What began as a personal experiment in sustainability evolved into a regenerative, off-grid-inspired ecosystem that converts waste into soil, food, and community education. Zach explains how worms, compost, and black soldier flies work together to rebuild soil and produce nutrient-dense food. The conversation highlights practical, scalable solutions for local food systems using simple, accessible technologies.
Our Guest:  Zach semi-retired from healthcare management at the age of 42 when his consulting company went public, and when his first of three grandchildren were born, he went back to Arizona State University to get a second master's degree in sustainability. Frustrated that most causes of climate change were not only fixable, but fixable with off the shelf practices and technology, Zach set out to prove that an off-grid lifestyle could be every bit as comfortable as a wasteful lifestyle and have a positive impact on the environment. And the most exciting thing...Zach has now built Arizona Worm Farm into one of the largest most successful worm farms in the United States.
What is the Arizona Worm Farm?
A regenerative, working farm designed to turn food waste into compost, soil fertility, and food production while educating the community on sustainable gardening practices.
How did Zach Brooks get started in worm farming?
After a career in healthcare, Zach pursued a sustainability degree and became motivated to address climate challenges using practical, existing solutions. He started by rebuilding dead soil using worms.
How large has the operation become?
The farm produces over 4.5 million worms annually, supports thousands of customers, and manages millions more worms dedicated to compost production.
What role do worms play in soil regeneration?
Worms convert organic matter into nutrient-rich castings filled with beneficial microbes that improve soil health, fertility, and plant growth.
What do the worms eat at scale?
Primarily pre-composted organic waste, including horse manure, landscape waste, and pre-consumer food scraps from caterers and food processors.
Why is local composting important?
Fresh, local compost contains active microbial life and reduces landfill waste, creating a closed-loop system that supports local food production.
What are black soldier flies and why are they important?
They are composting insects whose larvae consume waste rapidly and convert it into high-quality protein for animals, offering a sustainable alternative feed source.
What makes Arizona Worm Farm a “one-stop shop” for gardeners?
It combines education, compost, worms, plant starts, and regenerative techniques to help people successfully grow food at home.
How does the farm generate revenue beyond worms?
Through classes, compost products, plant starts, and value-added inputs like worm tea and insect-based fertilizers.
What is the long-term vision behind the farm?
To demonstrate that regenerative, self-sustaining systems can support communities using simple inputs like sunlight, water, and organic waste.
Episode Highlights
Built from a dead cotton field into a regenerative ecosystem
Scaled from 400,000 to 4.5 million worms annually
Produces 80,000 worms per week through controlled breeding
Diverts large volumes of food waste from landfills
Integrates composting, aquaponics, and food forests
Hosts highly sought-after, sold-out educational classes
Produces 400–800 lbs of insect protein weekly via black soldier flies
Demonstrates year-round food production in a desert climate

Key Topics
Arizona Worm Farm
Zach Brooks
Worm composting (vermiculture)
Black soldier fly larvae systems
Regenerative agriculture
Soil microbiology & soil food web
Composting systems (hot compost + worm compost)
Food waste diversion
Off-grid living systems
Aquaponics integration
Seasonal planting strategies
Urban farming education programs
Local food systems & backyard gardening
Sustainable protein production (insects)

Resources
Arizona Worm Farm — https://arizonawormfarm.com
Show Notes — https://urbanfarm.org/azWormFarm
Classes & Workshops — Available via website mailing list
Self-Guided Farm Tours — Visit in South Phoenix

Visit www.urbanfarm.org/AZWormFarm for the show notes on this episode, and access to our full podcast library!
Need a little bit of advice or just a feedback on your design for your yard or garden?The Urban Farm Team is offering consults over the phone or zoom. Get the benefits of a personalized garden and yard space analysis without the cost of trip charges. You can chat with Greg or choose one of the senior members of our Urban Farm team to get permaculture based feedback.Click HERE to learn more!

*Disclosure: Some of the links in our podcast show notes and blog posts are affiliate links and if you go through them to make a purchase, we will earn a nominal commission at no cost to you. We offer links to items recommended by our podcast guests and guest writers as a service to our audience and these items are not selected because of the commission we receive from your purchases. We know the decision is yours, and whether you decide to buy something is completely up to you.