An Art To It

Before she was a painter, Tamara Williams spent 25 years running a successful London design agency - it was a career she loved, creating work for a wide range of clients including Marks & Spencer and Burberry. It was only after selling the business that she discovered printmaking, and a happy accident with plaster of Paris that led, eventually, to painting.
Tamara shares her journey and the serendipity of discovering her passion for painting. We also talk about the realities of running a creative business and how, despite building a design practice, there was no cross over with the art world; a world she says that really has no rules!
In this episode, Tamara and I talk about:
Being inspired to study graphic design by her older sister ten years who introduced her to  the work of Saul Bass and Milton Glaser when she was still a child.
Going freelance almost by accident in 1989, hiring a cupboard-sized studio near Oxford Circus, and growing the agency from two people - and a dog - into a successful 25-year business
The plaster of Paris experiment that started everything - an attempt to transfer printmaking images without a press, that produced textures and effects she could never have planned
Taking up the suggestion of her friend and ceramicist Ali Tomlin https://www.alitomlin.com/ to take part in her first trade show at Top Drawer, at London's Olympia; being terrified but coming away with her first order book and her first ever conversations with gallery owners
Launching RubyKite, the silk scarf brand she co-founded with a friend, and the decision - after six wonderful years - to close it this December
Learning, the hard way, to say no to galleries: "It's really difficult to maintain creativity if you feel like you're a hamster on a wheel"
Having her painting Leave No Trace accepted into the 2025 Royal Academy Summer Exhibition, and the extraordinary tradition of Varnishing Day
Why she believes artists need a "visual compass" for their own work.
The business discipline she brought from design - timesheets, pricing, strategic thinking - and why creativity and commercial thinking aren't opposites
 
Find Tamara's work at tamarawilliams.co.uk and on Instagram @tamarawilliamsart

When CAN you call yourself a ceramicist? Kate Clark's @K_ceramics beautiful hand carved ceramics are sold across the country, from the Outer Hebrides to Cornwall, and even over to France. Her many fans include three generations of one family who all independently buy her work; and she still doesn't quite think she's earned the word "potter." She still adds that she's "also a Graphic Designer, as that's what my degree is in."
In our lovely chat, Kate talks openly about her journey to being a full time ceramicist:
"I've had loads of lessons, I've been taught by fantastic people," she told me, "but I haven't got the stamp, as it were."
But when you're making - and selling exquisite work - what more of an endorsement do you need? Kate's passion for pottery began while living with her family in New York City, she followed her kids to an after-school pottery class, fell in love watching them make things, asked if adults could join in, and never really left. She says her first bowl was awful but her teacher persuaded her to persevere and then it clicked.
We also talk about:
Re-inventing yourself in a new city
The buzz of selling your work to people who fall in love with it
Learning to throw from two different teachers on opposite sides of Manhattan, then not owning a wheel of her own until lockdown forced her hand
Why hand-carving makes almost every piece one of a kind - and why that's a nightmare to price, because "it's not just that piece, it's planning the carving, it's the act of doing
The stockist who spent months patiently waiting for Kate to feel ready, after Kate turned down several early offers because being asked for stock felt overwhelming
The particular strain of imposter syndrome that seems to follow talented ceramicists specifically - despite years of teaching, a beautifully considered brand, and genuinely excellent work
The message from a customer that told her three generations of one family buy her work, and why that means so much to her
Bringing her graphic design background into building a considered, cohesive ceramics brand from the very first pot she ever labelled
 
Find Kate's work at https://kceramicsstudio.com/ and on Instagram @K_ceramics

Painting shop shop-window mannequins in Chelsea is not a traditional way to learn the art of blending oil paints, but it's just one of the steps on Sally Hirst's journey to becoming both an artist and a hugely popular tutor.
 
Sally was in Spain in the spring of 2020 when it became clear that the workshops she'd planned for the summer back in Norfolk were unlikely to happen. She got the last flight out of Malaga, announced on social media that she'd find a way to teach online, wrote a blog about it for Jackson's Art Supplies and woke the next morning to around four hundred emails -  because Jackson's had listed her online courses, which did not yet exist, among their ten things to do during lockdown.
 
What followed is one of the more decisive pivots I've heard about. She went from a newbie on YouTube to thousands of followers and the beginning of a thriving business.
Six years on she has twenty-four courses, around a hundred hours of video, two Instagram accounts, and a book out this autumn. She's also refreshingly candid about the parts that haven't worked: the second Instagram account that never took off, the gallery representation that's been "somewhat elusive," and the awkward suspicion that not needing gallery sales might mean she doesn't chase them hard enough.
We also talk about her teaching career which she gave up at time she still had the energy to pursue other things, and how it - and her MA - have helped her develop her teaching style for the artists she works with.
 
In this episode:
Why Sally took a whole year off her own practice - and how she avoids resentment when doing two jobs
The GP who tore up her job application and told her to sort herself out
ADHD as a superpower, and what a late diagnosis actually changed
Why a teaching qualification matters more for developing artists than for teaching skills
"Leave your audience at the door" and why she advises students not to post new explorations
Selling her work well in Spain yet finding UK galleries elusive
Writing a book: 50,000 words, hundreds of captions, and no exclamation marks
 
You can find Sally's work and courses here:
https://sallyhirstcourses.com/
https://www.sallyhirst.co.uk/
@sallyhirst_courses @sallyhirstartist
Her Book, Printmaking for Collage is out this Autumn
https://www.crowood.com/book/printmaking-for-collage/

After 13 years of running a successful jewellery business, Claire Gent knew that something no longer felt right, but she wasn't sure what should come next.
 
Picking up an art book in a cafe on a family holiday in Penzance she discovered the work of  contemporary painter Alasdair Lindsay https://www.alasdairlindsay.co.uk/; she fell in love with it and it sparked a passion for her to pick up her own paintbrushes. What began as a new creative interest rapidly became an obsession.
 
In 2024, Claire tested a small collection of paintings alongside her jewellery at the annual Contemporary Craft Festival in Bovey Tracey in Devon https://craftfestival.co.uk/. She sold almost every piece, returned home with just two paintings and her partner immediately suggested they build her a studio. And so began this chapter of Claire's creative career.
 
In our chat Claire talks candidly about losing her love for her jewellery business and the excitement of moving onto painting, how she is carrying the skills from one creative career into another, and learning from the burnout she experienced while supplying multiple galleries.
 
We also discuss:
 
• Recognising when a successful business is no longer making you happy
• Testing a new creative direction before committing fully
• Beginning again without beginning from nothing
• Allowing your own artistic voice to emerge from your influences
• Using a part-time job to support the development of your work
• Pacing growth and resisting the pressure to accept every opportunity
• Why Instagram should support the work rather than become the work
• The many hats - and occasional grown-up decisions - involved in running a creative business
 
You can see Claire's gorgeous semi-abstract field-scapes - with a hint of the sea - inspired by her home in Cornwall on her website https://www.clairegent.com/

Some guests really need more than one episode, and Kellie Miller is one of them. A successful artist in her own right, she is also founder and director of Kellie Miller Arts, a renowned Brighton gallery representing an exciting mix of national, international and local artists. She also teaches, is involved in philanthropy and plays a major role in the creative life of  Brighton - she just has to come back for another chat.
But in this very entertaining episode we talk about the realities of life on both sides of the gallery wall: the freedom (and occasional exhaustion) of wearing two hats, why curating is its own act of creativity rather than a lesser cousin to "real" art, and why Kellie believes entrepreneurship is vital in being a successful artist.
Kellie is also refreshingly honest about the business side of running a gallery - how gallery pricing actually works, why undercutting a gallery by selling direct to a client who found you through them is one of the fastest ways to end a relationship, and why she thinks art fairs have had their day. She also talks candidly about a pop-up space she lost at the last minute - and the lesson in handling disappointment that came out of it.
In this episode:
Why being an artist and a gallery owner gives Kellie authority in supporting the artists she represents 

The invisible labour of curating - and why "you're just a curator" undersells what a gallery actually does

How she built her stable of 70 artists, and why the window for taking on new ones is smaller than people think

What she's really looking for in a submission 

Why keeping consistent pricing across the board is essential for artists - and what happens when artists forget that

The real cost of art fairs

Handling disappointment with grace -  and why it pays off later




You can find out more about Kellie and her gallery at kelliemillerarts.com @kelliemillerarts