Curious Equestrian

Shelby Dennis was taught to "get after" horses from the age of four, showing on the Arabian circuit and told not to worry: they're big animals, it doesn't hurt them. Then a rescue horse called Milo squared up to fight her when she escalated pressure the way she'd been taught, and everything she'd internalised started to come apart.

That's where this conversation with the IAABC-certified equine behaviour consultant and author of Secrets of the Horse begins. There was another catalyst too: when her family went bankrupt and her horse moved from a show barn to a yard with herd turnout on 20 acres, his spooking and bolting stopped almost overnight, and nothing in his training had changed. Now she trains with positive reinforcement, on the principle that all behaviour is a symptom of an underlying feeling: a horse can't disrespect you, because respect is a human concept.

From there, she and host Anna Louise Claydon take the same questions to the sport itself. Can equestrian competition ever be ethical? Shelby's answer is yes, but not under the current governing bodies. She points to the FEI's softened blood rule, the equipment still permitted at the top levels, and a study that found oral lesions in 87 to 88% of horses examined after an upper-level cross-country test (one event, as she's careful to say, and one that needs replicating). Her challenge to the industry is simple: if these things are truly harmless, prove it.

The conversation also turns to the humans: trigger stacking, emotional regulation, and the permission not to ride today; and the connection between neurodivergent minds and horses, which Anna (freshly diagnosed with ADHD) and Shelby (diagnosed later in life) both speak to from experience.

In this episode:
- How being taught to dominate horses unravelled, one rescue horse at a time
- How moving one horse to herd turnout on 20 acres did what training never had
- Why positive reinforcement gives a horse a reason to enjoy the work, where pressure and release can only offer relief
- Whether equestrian competition can ever be ethical, and why Shelby says not under the current governing bodies
- The FEI blood rule, permitted equipment, and the cross-country oral lesion study
- Trigger stacking, emotional regulation, and honouring your body around horses
- Neurodivergence, masking, and why so many neurodivergent people are drawn to horses

Find Shelby Dennis
Book: Secrets of the Horse
Paperback: https://uk.bookshop.org/a/4745/9781608689736
Audiobook: https://uk.bookshop.org/a/4745/9798349163685
Website: milestoneequestrian.ca (Publications tab)
Instagram @sdequus | Facebook Milestone Equestrian | TikTok @sdequus
(The Bookshop.org links are affiliate links: they support independent bookshops and Curious Equestrian at no extra cost to you.)

Curious Equestrian
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What if your horse isn't being naughty at all, but telling you something you were never taught to hear? Horsemanship expert Marcel Olivé joins Curious Equestrian to challenge everything we assume about horse psychology, and why the words we reach for, stubborn, lazy, mischievous, moody, almost always miss what the horse is actually saying.Drawing on more than 15 years with horses and his book The Truth About Your Horse, Marcel argues that good horse psychology starts by dropping the idea that we're the boss. Horses aren't kings and queens who want luxury; they're animals with a hierarchy of needs, and until food, freedom, safety and social contact are met, no amount of training will build the partnership we're after.In this episode:→ Why "we treat horses like kings and queens" fundamentally misreads what a horse actually wants→ The Horse's Hierarchy of Needs explained, from food and freedom of movement to safety, socialisation, confidence and fulfilment→ Why most "bad" behaviour is hidden pain or fear rather than stubbornness, and what horse psychology asks you to look for instead→ How the release of pressure, not the pressure itself, is what actually teaches a horse anything→ Why "respect the no" matters, and how forcing a horse into a trailer or a headcollar tends to backfire→ What walking with your horse, and sometimes doing nothing at all, does for connection that riding never will→ Why Marcel says the human, not the horse, is almost always the thing that needs to changeAbout Marcel OlivéMarcel Olivé is a horsemanship expert, equine-assisted facilitator and performance coach who came to horses as an adult and has spent more than 15 years pruning traditional methods down to what actually holds up under scrutiny. He is the author of The Truth About Your Horse and the creator of The Horse's Hierarchy of Needs, a free infographic he wants on the wall of every yard, stable and training centre. His work covers horse psychology in all its forms: horse behaviour and communication, equine welfare, the horse's hierarchy of needs, pressure-and-release training, and why understanding a horse matters far more than controlling it. Marcel's books are available on Amazon, and more about his current projects can be found on his website.
Resources & links→ https://www.marcelolive.com/original-horses-hierarchy-of-needs→ Marcel Olivé's website: https://www.marcelolive.com/

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She worked inside horse racing. Then she started saying the things most people in the sport won't.After multiple racehorse deaths at the 2026 Cheltenham Festival and Grand National, the outrage landed on race day. But Alex Fleming says the deaths you see are not horse racing's biggest welfare problem. The harder question is the ordinary life of the racehorse: stabled for most of the day, little or no turnout or herd life, hard feed in place of forage, and stomach ulcers so common they have come to be treated as normal. They are said to live like kings, she argues, when what they actually want is to live like horses.It's a candid, good-faith conversation about what needs to change in horse racing, and why Alex believes education, not blame, is what will change it. She points to yards proving that better welfare and real success go together, and explains why she isn't calling for a ban, but won't rule one out either.Alex Fleming got into racing after a trip to Cheltenham for her 18th birthday. She trained at the British Racing College, worked in racing yards and freelanced riding out, and now retrains and rehomes ex-racehorses. Her Facebook post calling for an overhaul of the sport went viral after the 2026 Grand National.In this episode:– Why the deaths on race day aren't horse racing's biggest welfare problem– What daily life is really like for a racehorse: turnout, forage and stomach ulcers– Why nearly every ex-racehorse comes home with ulcers, and what that tells us– How breeding for speed has raised the risk of injury– What happens to thoroughbreds when their racing days end– Why educating the owners who fund racing might be what finally changes itA note on this conversation: Alex speaks from her own experience and opinion, and deliberately does not name the yards she refers to. This is a public-interest discussion of horse welfare, not a criticism of any particular yard or individual, and it is general discussion rather than veterinary advice. If you have concerns about your own horse, speak to your vet.Join our free newsletter, The Inquisitive Herd, for the listener Q&A with Alex that carries on after the cameras stop, plus producer Theresa's take.Find Alex Fleming on Facebook (Alex Fleming) and at coaching4confidence.co.uk

Lucy Katan MBE spent more than eight years as a horse groom, including time at the top of international dressage. She loved the horses, but she was also bullied on the yard and, after a dangerous 24-hour drive home from the 2002 World Equestrian Games, decided enough was enough. She wrote one letter to the British Equestrian Federation, and it became the British Grooms Association.
In this episode, Anna Louise and Lucy talk honestly about why so many grooms struggle: illegal hours, pay below the minimum wage, bullying that gets excused as "just the way it is with horses", and the 2017 survey in which 83% of grooms reported poor mental health and more than 70% reported bullying at work. Lucy also shares practical advice for anyone in a difficult yard, and where to find help.
An honest conversation about welfare, work and worth in the equestrian industry.
Find help and support:British Grooms Association: https://britishgrooms.org.ukGrooms Minds: https://britishgrooms.org.uk/member-services/grooms-minds/grooms-mindsEquestrian Employers Association: https://equestrianemployers.org.ukRiders Minds, 24/7 helpline: https://ridersminds.org

What does it mean to fight for horse welfare when being visible would cost you your livelihood?
Riverstown Farm Stables — an anonymous Irish equestrian with over 37,000 followers and no public face (we've altered her voice to protect her identity) — joins Anna Louise at Curious Equestrian to talk honestly about the equine welfare conversations the industry keeps sweeping under the carpet.
Drawing on years of working in professional yards across Europe, Riverstown argues that the equestrian world is still hiding from some basic truths: about turnout, about where horses end up when we sell them, and about what it actually takes to put the horse before the sport, the tradition, or the convenience.
In this episode:→ Why a welfare campaigner with 37,000 followers chooses to stay anonymous→ What working at a stallion station in Germany taught Riverstown about horses living behind bars with no turnout and no social contact→ Why paddock gardens are a genuine step forward — but can also be abused to replace real turnout→ The uncomfortable reality of horse slaughter in the UK and Ireland, and the passport loopholes that make it invisible→ Why horses still don't have the same traceability system as cattle — and what it would take to change that→ What the bitless dressage movement signals about where equestrian sport could be heading→ How traditional farming families are starting to question practices they have accepted for generations

About Riverstown Farm StablesAn anonymous welfare-first Facebook page with over 37,000 followers. Based in rural Ireland, the person behind the page is a riding instructor and equine welfare advocate who created the page to give horse people a space for honest, unfiltered discussion without the politics of personal identity.www.facebook.com/RiverstownStablesNorthTipp

About Curious EquestrianA horse-first podcast about welfare, behaviour, and the messy realities of ownership. Subscribe to the free newsletter for after-hours Q&As and bonus content: www.curiousequestrian.co.uk