Point of Relation with Thomas Huebl

This week, Thomas sits down with trauma researcher, life coach, and author Dr. MaryCatherine McDonald, for a conversation on the importance of curiosity in trauma healing, the difficult necessity of turning towards pain, and how to “compost” our wounds into fertile soil for inner growth.

They discuss how to shift away from the isolation that trauma creates and lean into connection, empathy, and shared responsibility as part of the healing process. They frame our conscious inquiry into our suffering as a sort of real-world alchemy that transforms the stagnant energy of the past into an integrated future.

Ultimately, a special kind of courage is required to investigate trauma with openness and curiosity, and we hope this dialogue inspires some of that courage in anyone watching or listening.

✨ Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube:
👉 https://youtu.be/9vLUGEyGBkg
Video episodes are typically posted at 8am PT/ 11am ET

✨ Join Thomas and the CEO of Mobius Executive Leadership, Amy Elizabeth Fox, on Tuesday, March 31 for a free, live, online event - When Chaos is the Context: Bringing a Trauma-Informed Approach to Coaching & Consulting

They'll explore how to recognize and work with the underlying dynamics that shape behavior and culture in organizations to bring greater depth and impact to your work.

Register for free here 👉https://traumainformedcertificateprogram.com/event

✨MaryCatherine McDonald, PhD, is a research professor and life coach who specializes in the psychology of trauma, stress, and resilience. She has been researching, lecturing, and publishing on the neuroscience, psychology, and lived experience of trauma and stress for over a decade. She is passionate about destigmatizing trauma, stress, and mental health issues and reframing our understanding of trauma.

Connect with Dr. McDonald here 👉 https://alchemycoaching.life

Thomas Hübl, PhD, is a renowned teacher, author, and international facilitator who works within the complexity of systems and cultural change, integrating the core insights of the great wisdom traditions and mysticism with the discoveries of science. Since the early 2000s, he has led large-scale events and courses on the healing of collective trauma.
In addition to Attuned, he is the author of Healing Collective Trauma: A Process for Integrating Our Intergenerational and Cultural Wounds. He has served as an advisor and guest faculty for universities and organizations, as a coach for CEOs and organizational leaders, and is currently a visiting scholar at the Wyss Institute at Harvard University.

✨ Connect with Thomas here:
Website: https://thomashuebl.com/
Point of Relation Podcast: https://pointofrelationpodcast.com
Facebook: https://facebook.com/Thomas.Huebl.Sangha/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thomashuebl/
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/ThomasHuebl
YouTube: https://youtube.com/@thomashuebl

✨ Order Thomas and Internal Family Systems founder Dr. Richard Schwartz's co-authored book, Releasing Our Burdens, here:
👉 https://www.releasingourburdens.com

Take our listener survey! We'd love your feedback on which topics and guests are resonating with you and which ones you'd like to hear more about in the future:
👉 https://forms.gle/uoygyKMmHeUHeJFD9

This week, Thomas shares a teaching that explores boundary setting as a deep spiritual practice that allows us to embody our authentic inner experience. When we define and share our boundaries, we’re not creating walls to shut others out; we’re engaging in a fluid dance that acknowledges our pain, creates safety, and actually helps us become less rigid and defensive.
Thomas discusses why it’s so difficult for some of us to establish boundaries, and shares conscious, relational tools to help us stay present with pain, move from isolation to interdependence, and learn to treat life’s challenges as a path to spiritual maturity.

He also explores the importance of specificity as we learn to better attune to ourselves and others, and how that impacts our individual, ancestral, and collective healing.

✨ Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube:
👉 https://youtu.be/o8k01R2dReM
Video episodes are typically posted at 8am PT/ 11am ET

✨ Join Thomas and the CEO of Mobius Executive Leadership, Amy Elizabeth Fox, on March 31 for a free, live, online event - When Chaos is the Context: Bringing a Trauma-Informed Approach to Coaching & Consulting

They'll explore how to recognize and work with the underlying dynamics that shape behavior and culture in organizations to bring greater depth and impact to your work.

Register for free here 👉https://traumainformedcertificateprogram.com/event

Thomas Hübl, PhD, is a renowned teacher, author, and international facilitator who works within the complexity of systems and cultural change, integrating the core insights of the great wisdom traditions and mysticism with the discoveries of science. Since the early 2000s, he has led large-scale events and courses on the healing of collective trauma.
In addition to Attuned, he is the author of Healing Collective Trauma: A Process for Integrating Our Intergenerational and Cultural Wounds. He has served as an advisor and guest faculty for universities and organizations, as a coach for CEOs and organizational leaders, and is currently a visiting scholar at the Wyss Institute at Harvard University.

✨ Connect with Thomas here:
Website: https://thomashuebl.com/
Facebook: https://facebook.com/Thomas.Huebl.Sangha/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thomashuebl/
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/ThomasHuebl
YouTube: https://youtube.com/@thomashuebl

Take our listener survey! We'd love your feedback on which topics and guests are resonating with you and which ones you'd like to hear more about in the future:
👉 https://forms.gle/uoygyKMmHeUHeJFD9

This week, Thomas sits down with meditation instructors Susanne Ahlendorf and Martin Bruders for a deep exploration of heart-centered meditation, moving beyond the physical heart to uncover its emotional, energetic, and spiritual layers.
Discover why your emotional defenses, aka the "guardians of the heart", are an intelligent part of your healing journey, and how vulnerability leads to deeper connection and a more embodied meditation practice.
We also explore a path toward entering the “cave of the heart,” which may sound like traveling to a distant and ethereal place, but is actually an awakening to the reality of your authentic self.

✨ Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube:
👉 https://youtu.be/_Wb1CSonBeg
Video episodes are typically posted at 8am PT/ 11am ET

Susanne and Martin are teaching a new meditation course this April that will provide a powerful, in-depth exploration of these topics. It's called:
❤️ The Heart of Meditation: Exploring the Depths of Your Practice

In this 4-week online course, you'll explore the emotional layers of the heart and learn meditation practices to help you consistently access a peaceful and resourced inner space.

Learn more & register here 👉 https://thomashuebl.com/meditation-course-april-2026/

✨ Join Thomas and the CEO of Mobius Executive Leadership, Amy Elizabeth Fox, on March 31 for a free, live, online event - When Chaos is the Context: Bringing a Trauma-Informed Approach to Coaching & Consulting

They'll explore how to recognize and work with the underlying dynamics that shape behavior and culture in organizations to bring greater depth and impact to your work.

Register for free here 👉https://traumainformedcertificateprogram.com/event

Explore more teachings and meditations from Martin and Susanne via their co-founded organization, Make Space for Grace 👉 https://www.makespaceforgrace.de ... and on their YouTube Channel 👉 http://www.youtube.com/@MeditationEnglish

✨ Susanne Ahlendorf is a non-medical practitioner for psychotherapy, a group leader for meditation and Inner Science practice, who accompanies people on their personal and spiritual development path. For her, meditation is a way of unfolding love in life.

Connect with Susanne here:
👉 https://www.susanneahlendorf.de

✨ Martin Bruders is a qualified social worker, mediator, and coach. He worked for over 28 years as a comedian and presenter at over 2000 corporate events in Germany, Austria, and Switzerland. His inner exploration journey is as much about his meditation practice as it is about his daily life. He loves to permeate life deeper and deeper, always in search of intimacy with the divine; sometimes succeeding, sometimes failing.

Connect with Martin here:
👉 https://www.martinbruders.de

✨ Order Thomas and Internal Family Systems founder Dr. Richard Schwartz's co-authored book, Releasing Our Burdens, here:
👉 https://www.releasingourburdens.com

Thomas Hübl, PhD, is a renowned teacher, author, and international facilitator who works within the complexity of systems and cultural change, integrating the core insights of the great wisdom traditions and mysticism with the discoveries of science. Since the early 2000s, he has led large-scale events and courses on the healing of collective trauma.
In addition to Attuned, he is the author of Healing Collective Trauma: A Process for Integrating Our Intergenerational and Cultural Wounds. He has served as an advisor and guest faculty for universities and organizations, as a coach for CEOs and organizational leaders, and is currently a visiting scholar at the Wyss Institute at Harvard University.

✨ Connect with Thomas here:
Website: https://thomashuebl.com/
Facebook: https://facebook.com/Thomas.Huebl.Sangha/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thomashuebl/
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/ThomasHuebl
YouTube: https://youtube.com/@thomashuebl

Take our listener survey! We'd love your feedback on which topics and guests are resonating with you and which ones you'd like to hear more about in the future:
👉 https://forms.gle/uoygyKMmHeUHeJFD9

This week, Thomas sits down with the CEO of Mobius Executive Leadership, Amy Elizabeth Fox, for a conversation about bringing trauma-informed wisdom and embodied presence into leadership, organizations, coaching, and consulting work.
They discuss how traditional coaching and leadership development are inadequate for increasingly chaotic times, where unresolved personal and collective trauma create unhealthy environments that lack resilience.

Thomas and Amy offer tools and practices for down-regulating stress, creating psychological safety, and fostering a workplace rooted in deep connection and belonging—where creativity drives progress instead of fear.

They also discuss Amy’s new book co-authored with Nicholas Janni, Leading in Chaos, which you can learn about in more detail below.

✨ Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube:
👉 https://youtu.be/dwepmJHG_sg
Video episodes are typically posted at 8am PT/ 11am ET

Join Thomas and Amy on March 31 for a free, live, online event -✨When Chaos is the Context: Bringing a Trauma-Informed Approach to Coaching & Consulting ✨

They'll explore how to recognize and work with the underlying dynamics that shape behavior and culture in organizations to bring greater depth and impact to your work.

Register for free here 👉https://traumainformedcertificateprogram.com/event

✨ Leading in Chaos: Available for Pre-Order
Amy Elizabeth Fox and Nicholas Janni, dear friends and students of Thomas, are publishing Leading in Chaos, arguing that what’s required in today's world is not better tools or frameworks, but “next practice” — a trauma-informed approach to leadership as an embodied, developmental practice.
Pre-order the book and read the sample chapter here 👉 https://leadinginchaosbook.com/

✨ Amy Elizabeth Fox is the Co-founder and the Chief Executive Officer of Mobius Executive Leadership, a global transformational leadership firm. For more than twenty years, she has advised senior leaders and organizations on leadership development, culture change, and organizational transformation. Amy regularly leads intensive multi-day leadership programs for senior executives and public sector leaders and is widely recognized for her work integrating trauma-informed development and psycho-spiritual principles into leadership education.
Connect with Amy here 👉 https://www.mobiusleadership.com

✨ Order Thomas and Internal Family Systems founder Dr. Richard Schwartz's co-authored book, Releasing Our Burdens, here:
👉 https://www.releasingourburdens.com

Thomas Hübl, PhD, is a renowned teacher, author, and international facilitator who works within the complexity of systems and cultural change, integrating the core insights of the great wisdom traditions and mysticism with the discoveries of science. Since the early 2000s, he has led large-scale events and courses on the healing of collective trauma.
In addition to Attuned, he is the author of Healing Collective Trauma: A Process for Integrating Our Intergenerational and Cultural Wounds. He has served as an advisor and guest faculty for universities and organizations, as a coach for CEOs and organizational leaders, and is currently a visiting scholar at the Wyss Institute at Harvard University.

✨ Connect with Thomas here:
Website: https://thomashuebl.com/
Facebook: https://facebook.com/Thomas.Huebl.Sangha/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thomashuebl/
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/ThomasHuebl
YouTube: https://youtube.com/@thomashuebl

Take our listener survey! We'd love your feedback on which topics and guests are resonating with you and which ones you'd like to hear more about in the future:
👉 https://forms.gle/uoygyKMmHeUHeJFD9

This week, Thomas sits down with celebrated speaker, posthumanist thinker, poet, teacher, and author, Bayo Akomolafe, for a philosophical and spiritual exploration into how we understand reality and the radical perception shifts and awakenings that are necessary for true social transformation to become possible.
In his uniquely poetic way, Bayo interrogates traditional solutions to social and ecological problems that only uphold harmful norms, and offers that real change is brought about through what he calls “cracks”—disruptions to systems and modes of thinking that inspire new ideas instead of trying to bring about change via the ineffective paths that are already built into our failing social structures.

He and Thomas discuss the discomfort that comes with ushering in new realities, and how important it is that we lean in to this uncomfortable uncertainty, embrace radical compassion, and rethink our relationship to the more-than-human world.

✨ Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube:
👉 https://youtu.be/U7kgPzozjlY
Video episodes are typically posted at 8am PT/ 11am ET

✨ Bayo Akomolafe is a widely celebrated international speaker, posthumanist thinker, poet, teacher, public intellectual, essayist, and author of books including These Wilds Beyond our Fences: Letters to My Daughter on Humanity’s Search for Home and We Will Tell our Own Story: The Lions of Africa Speak. Bayo is the founder of The Emergence Network and host of the online post-activist course, ‘We Will Dance with Mountains’. He currently lectures at Pacifica Graduate Institute, California, and the University of Vermont, Burlington, Vermont.

Connect with Bayo here: 👉 https://bayoakomolafe.net

✨ Order Thomas and Internal Family Systems founder Dr. Richard Schwartz's co-authored book, Releasing Our Burdens, here:
👉 https://www.releasingourburdens.com

Thomas Hübl, PhD, is a renowned teacher, author, and international facilitator who works within the complexity of systems and cultural change, integrating the core insights of the great wisdom traditions and mysticism with the discoveries of science. Since the early 2000s, he has led large-scale events and courses on the healing of collective trauma.
In addition to Attuned, he is the author of Healing Collective Trauma: A Process for Integrating Our Intergenerational and Cultural Wounds. He has served as an advisor and guest faculty for universities and organizations, as a coach for CEOs and organizational leaders, and is currently a visiting scholar at the Wyss Institute at Harvard University.

✨ Connect with Thomas here:
Website: https://thomashuebl.com/
Facebook: https://facebook.com/Thomas.Huebl.Sangha/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thomashuebl/
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/ThomasHuebl
YouTube: https://youtube.com/@thomashuebl

Take our listener survey! We'd love your feedback on which topics and guests are resonating with you and which ones you'd like to hear more about in the future:
👉 https://forms.gle/uoygyKMmHeUHeJFD9