Untidy Faith

• Julia Rocchi | Asking Better Spiritual Questions

  In this episode of the Untidy Faith Podcast, host Kate Boyd sits down with Julia Rocchi to explore how design thinking principles can transform our approach to spiritual questioning. Julia, a practicing Roman Catholic with expertise in design thinking and facilitation, shares how asking better questions—rather than seeking definitive answers—can deepen our faith journey and create space for mystery and growth. This conversation offers practical tools for those navigating doubt, deconstruction, or simply wanting to cultivate a more curious and expansive relationship with God.Topics Covered* Design Thinking Meets Faith: How principles from design thinking—particularly the art of asking strong, open-ended questions—can enhance spiritual exploration and move us beyond binary thinking* Questions as Tools, Not Threats: Reframing spiritual questioning as complementary to faith rather than opposing it, and understanding how curiosity can foster humility, compassion, and spiritual growth* The Design Thinking Examen: A practical, step-by-step spiritual practice that adapts traditional Ignatian reflection with design thinking principles to help process life's challenges through productive questioning* Community and Embodied Faith: The vital role of community in spiritual questioning, including how sharing questions out loud transforms them and how healthy faith communities can enhance rather than restrict our spiritual curiosity* Productive Tension in Prayer: Embracing discomfort and uncertainty as valuable aspects of spiritual practice, learning to sit with questions rather than rushing toward answersTimestamps:01:47 Understanding Design Thinking05:10 The Power of Questions in Faith12:58 Design Thinking Tactics for Spiritual Growth16:35 Incorporating Questions into Spiritual Practice22:42 The Role of Community in Spiritual Questions This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit kateboyd.substack.com/subscribe

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• Sharifa Stevens | Honest Prayer

  In this episode of the Untidy Faith Podcast, host Kate Boyd welcomes back guest Sharifa Stevens to discuss her new book about prayer and poems. Their conversation explores how many Christians struggle with barriers to authentic prayer, often feeling they must approach God in a "perfect" way. Sharifa shares her journey toward understanding that there's no wrong way to bring our full selves to God, and how harmful theology has created unnecessary barriers between believers and authentic spiritual connection.Sharifa Stevens is a writer, poet, speaker, and singer. She is the daughter of Jamaican immigrants, born and raised in New York, and currently resides with her family in Dallas, Texas. She graduated from Columbia University in New York with a bachelor’s degree in African American Studies before earning a master’s in theology from Dallas Theological Seminary. Sharifa aspires to use writing as a vehicle that moves readers to intersect with the sacred and the honest. She co- authored Only Light Can Do That and contributed to the books Vindicating the Vixens, Rally, and Lecrae’s upcoming Set Me Free. Sharifa is married to a Renaissance man and is a mother to two lively boys.Topics Covered:* Barriers to prayer that many experience, including the feeling that we can't approach God with certain struggles or that we need to be in an "almost heavenly state of being" to pray* How performance-based faith and "worm theology" (focusing on our unworthiness) creates voids in our relationship with God and prevents authentic connection* The impact of gender on spiritual experiences, particularly how women are often infantilized in church contexts and discouraged from spiritual autonomy* How our bodies often signal when we're holding back parts of ourselves due to fear, and why vulnerability can be difficult after negative experiences* The value of written prayers and spiritual resources that give us language when we can't find our own words to express our experiences to GodTimestamps:02:06 Understanding Prayer and Barriers06:14 Personal Experiences with Prayer08:53 The Impact of Theology on Self-Perception21:34 The Role of Women in Faith and Society27:12 Jesus and His Treatment of Women28:34 Modern Conversations on Women's Roles30:03 The Impact of Bad Theology35:18 Navigating Faith and Mental Health38:46 The Importance of Community and Self-Trust44:04 Embracing Emotions and Coping Mechanisms46:35 The Role of Compassion in Faith This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit kateboyd.substack.com/subscribe

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• 2 Samuel 18 | The Tragic End of Absalom

  In this episode, we dive deep into one of the most bizarre and tragic chapters in the David narrative - the death of Absalom. Set against the backdrop of a father-son civil war, 2 Samuel 18 tells the surreal story of Absalom getting caught in a tree while riding a mule, and Joab's brutal decision to kill him despite David's explicit command to "deal gently" with his son. We explore the literary complexity of this text, including surprising parallels to Jesus' death, the politics of empire, and the profound cost of unchecked power dynamics within families and kingdoms.Topics Covered* The absurd circumstances of Absalom's death - How Absalom gets stuck in an oak tree while riding a mule and the darkly comic elements that make this biblical narrative so memorable* Literary parallels between Absalom and Jesus - The striking similarities including hanging from a tree, betrayal, burial under stones, and the presence of multiple messengers racing to deliver news* Joab's defiance and the exploitation of the Cushite messenger - How Joab deliberately ignores David's command and sends a foreign messenger (the Cushite) to deliver the devastating news, highlighting issues of belonging and exploitation of marginalized people* David's dual role as king and father - The tension between David's political needs as a ruler and his emotional devastation as a father, including the shift from calling Absalom "the young man" to "my son"* The broader costs of empire and injustice - How this tragic family drama reflects larger themes about the price of power, the perpetuation of cycles of violence, and the missed opportunity to address injustice against Tamar that started the whole conflictTimestamps:01:09 Recap of David and Absalom's Conflict02:07 The Battle and Absalom's Fate03:17 Joab's Defiance and Absalom's Death04:40 The Aftermath and David's Mourning05:26 Literary Parallels with the Crucifixion21:12 Joab's Role and the Cushite Messenger27:17 David's Dual Roles and Moral Dilemmas32:18 Takeaways This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit kateboyd.substack.com/subscribe

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• Liz Charlotte Grant | Reclaiming Scripture After Evangelical Upbringing

  Join Kate and Liz Charlotte Grant as they explore how to approach Scripture when traditional, literal interpretations no longer serve believers who are deconstructing or reframing their faith. Grant shares her journey of finding new ways to engage with biblical texts through literary analysis, diverse commentators, and interdisciplinary connections.Liz Charlotte Grant is an award-winning essayist, author of the Empathy List substack, and her debut book, a personal, interdisciplinary commentary on the book of Genesis, Knock at the Sky: Seeking God in Genesis After Losing Faith in the Bible is available now.Topics Covered:* How traditional methods of reading the Bible, especially within White American Evangelicalism, have been limiting and sometimes harmful, and why new approaches are needed for those reframing their faith* The importance of diverse voices in biblical interpretation, particularly from women, people of color, and other historically excluded groups who offer fresh perspectives beyond the dominant white male theological tradition* Grant's creative approach to Genesis through interdisciplinary connections—linking biblical stories to art, science, and literature to illuminate scripture in new ways* The distinction between factual accuracy and deeper truth in scripture, and why approaching the Bible through a literary lens can reveal profound insights without requiring historical literalism* Practical advice for those wanting to re-engage with the Bible after deconstruction, including starting with commentaries, trusting your own reading, and creating a diverse "table" of interpretive voicesGrant's book uses creative writing and non-traditional sources to approach Genesis with fresh eyes, demonstrating how scripture can remain meaningful even after one's relationship with the Bible has fundamentally changed.Timestamps:01:12 Reframing Faith and Reading the Bible01:49 Challenges of Traditional Biblical Interpretation04:43 The Importance of Diverse Perspectives10:18 Creative and Literary Approaches to the Bible11:19 Truth vs. Historicity in Biblical Texts17:12 Why Return to the Bible?18:06 The Making of the Bible: A Complex Process19:57 The Sinai Sisters: Manuscript Hunters23:19 Catherine Bushnell: A Pioneer for Women in the Bible26:41 Judith Butler: An Artist's Voice32:24 Reengaging with the Bible: Tools and Tips This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit kateboyd.substack.com/subscribe

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• Jennifer G. Layte | The Pilgrimage of Faith

  In this enlightening episode of the Untidy Faith Podcast, host Kate Boyd sits down with Jennifer Layte to explore the concept of stages of faith. Despite many Christians being taught that faith is static or linear, Jennifer shares insights from both James Fowler's modern framework and Teresa of Avila's 16th-century "Interior Castle" to help listeners understand that spiritual growth naturally involves distinct phases and transitions. This conversation offers comfort and clarity for those navigating their own changing relationship with Jesus, especially during periods of deconstruction or spiritual uncertainty.About Jennifer:Jennifer A. G. Layte is a pastor, author of two published novels, and founder of The Pilgrimage—a Jesus-centered online spiritual formation community, created especially to tend to the stories of those who have been hurt by the church or are otherwise struggling in their faith.Jennifer’s training and certification as an Advanced Practice Board Certified Chaplain, a spiritual director, and an ordained pastor have provided her with unique opportunities to work with diverse (on just about every metric) groups of people. The human stories she carries and the ways she has found to shepherd people through the difficult parts of those stories directly influence her writing. Meanwhile, her formal background in literature and theology gives her imaginative ways of retelling the stories of the Bible and of others, encouraging people to live within their own stories better.Jennifer and her husband Paul live in New England with their two adorable rescue dogs, an impressive garden, and, to their fascination but not always delight, an astonishing array of wildlife.Website and Social Media LinksJennifer’s Book Followerhttps://jenniferaglayte.comhttps://the-pilgrimage.orghttps://linktr.ee/jenniferaglayteTopics Covered:* Castles, Mansions, and Soul Work: Discover the fascinating historical frameworks for understanding faith transitions, from a 16th century nun's "Interior Castle" to modern psychological approaches* "I'm Not Sure God Is Anywhere": Why those terrifying spiritual dry spells might actually be doorways to deeper faith, and how knowing about stages can help you not panic when they arrive* When Church Activism Isn't Enough: Jennifer reveals the significant transition that many Western Christians are experiencing today, and why moving beyond the "busy doing" phase often feels so disruptive* Same Beliefs, Different Grip: How you might end up believing many of the same things but holding them completely differently—and why Jennifer went from firmly opposing women pastors to becoming one herself* Loving Across the Divide: Practical wisdom for those moments when you want to scream "Oh my God, what are these people thinking?"—and how to create meaningful connections with those in different faith stagesTimestamps:00:47 Stages of Faith: An Overview14:11 Challenges in Faith Transitions20:58 The Importance of Growth in Faith22:03 Evolving Beliefs and Perspectives28:37 Balancing Tradition and Change29:59 Engaging with Jesus in Faith32:49 Loving Others in Different Stages35:07 Grace in Imperfection This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit kateboyd.substack.com/subscribe

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