The Business of Dance

Recorded August 3, 2026 | The Business of Dance VIP Day, Los Angeles

EPISODE SUMMARY
Tina Landon and Travis Payne helped create the choreography for Michael and Janet Jackson’s “Scream.” In this live conversation with Menina Fortunato, the award-winning choreographers reunite to share two very different perspectives on the same iconic project—and the career lessons behind it. Recorded at The Business of Dance VIP Day in Los Angeles, this episode brings dancers into the room with two artists whose work has shaped music videos and world tours.

Tina traces her journey from Lancaster, California, to working with Janet Jackson, while Travis shares how his training in Atlanta and a homemade audition video opened the door to Rhythm Nation. Together, they revisit the pressure of creating for Michael and Janet: different movement styles, separate rehearsals, changing production demands, and the challenge of making the choreography feel right for both performers. Their stories reveal how much collaboration, preparation, and adaptability happen before the cameras roll.

The conversation then opens to questions from Business of Dance mentees about career longevity, saving money, artistic identity, and what makes a dancer someone choreographers want to hire again. From attitude and reputation to arriving prepared and continuing to learn, Tina and Travis offer practical lessons for aspiring professional dancers, working performers, and choreographers building careers that last.

SHOW NOTES
00:00 – Preview: dancing with Michael and Janet Jackson
02:46 – Menina welcomes Tina Landon and Travis Payne
07:26 – Tina’s beginnings and her path to Janet Jackson
10:12 – Travis’s journey from Atlanta to Rhythm Nation
16:29 – Creating “Scream”: Tina’s side of the story
23:32 – Choreographing for Michael and Janet’s different styles
26:32 – Travis’s path from Dangerous to “Scream”
30:13 – Separate rehearsals and the secrecy surrounding “Scream”
36:41 – Last-minute sets and the realities of production
42:42 – Why “Scream” continues to connect across generations
46:00 – Mentee Q&A: money and building a dance career
51:33 – Staying true to yourself for a lasting career
1:00:00 – What makes a dancer someone choreographers will hire?
1:02:44 – The qualities that earn repeat bookings
1:06:37 – Advice for dancers who want to choreograph

ABOUT TINA LANDON & TRAVIS PAYNE
Tina Landon is an Emmy-nominated choreographer and creative director whose credits include Janet Jackson, Michael Jackson, Rihanna, Ricky Martin, and Christina Aguilera. Her work includes Janet’s janet. and The Velvet Rope tours and co-choreography for “Scream.” Raised in Lancaster, California, she moved to Hollywood to pursue dance, performed as a Laker Girl, and appeared in Michael Jackson’s “Smooth Criminal.” She continues to share her experience with dancers navigating professional careers.

Travis Payne is an Emmy-nominated choreographer and director who began touring with Janet Jackson’s Rhythm Nation 1814 World Tour. His extensive work with Michael Jackson includes the Dangerous and HIStory tours, “Scream,” and This Is It. His collaborators also include Lady Gaga, Beyoncé, and Usher. The founder of Travis Payne Productions, he has earned MTV and American Choreography Awards for his work. His career spans live performance, music videos, concert production, and film, bringing a broad perspective to developing and sustaining a career in entertainment.

CONNECT WITH TINA LANDON
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/iamtinalandon/

CONNECT WITH TRAVIS PAYNE
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/travispayne1/
Website: https://www.travispayne.com

THE BUSINESS OF DANCE
https://www.bizofdance.com/thepodcast
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Recorded September 20, 2026

EPISODE SUMMARY
Chad Geiger, a Los Angeles talent agent with The Movement Talent Agency, joins Menina Fortunato to explain what helps dancers get noticed, earn representation, and build lasting careers. Drawing on his own work with Dua Lipa, Dolly Parton, and James Corden, he shares what he understands now from the other side of the audition table—and what he wishes he had done differently as a performer.

Chad traces his unexpected path from gymnastics in Texas to dance classes in college, professional work in Los Angeles, and an agency internship during the pandemic. He recalls how following directions helped him book a Dua Lipa music video and how embracing his personality changed his approach to auditions. He also explains why training with intention means seeking growth, building relationships, and getting into rooms with working professionals.

The conversation turns to the business habits that support a dance career: clear communication, updated materials, availability, and a reputation for reliability. In a mentee Q&A, Chad discusses agency submissions, dance footage, specialty skills, working outside major markets, and the patience needed to develop a career. This episode is perfect for aspiring professional dancers, dancers seeking an agent, and represented performers who want a stronger partnership with their agency.

SHOW NOTES
(00:00) – Introducing Chad Geiger and his dance career
(02:10) – From Dallas gymnastics to discovering dance in college
(06:59) – Booking Dua Lipa and embracing your individuality
(13:18) – Training with intention and building industry relationships
(18:22) – From MTA dancer and intern to talent agent
(27:00) – Agent communication, updated materials, and book-out dates
(36:00) – Building a strong agency submission and dance reel
(42:19) – Understanding opportunities at a boutique talent agency
(46:47) – Seeking representation while living outside major markets
(52:38) – Using tap skills to create a distinctive career
(54:24) – Professional habits that help dancers get booked again
(56:52) – Submission timing, referrals, and making a strong impression
(66:15) – Patience and building a professional career over time
(69:02) – Why reply-all matters when communicating about jobs
(73:42) – How to connect with Chad and MTA

ABOUT CHAD GEIGER
Chad Geiger is a Los Angeles-based talent agent with The Movement Talent Agency and has more than a decade of experience in the dance industry. As a performer, he worked with Dua Lipa, James Corden, Dolly Parton, Meek Mill, and Miguel, with appearances on Carpool Karaoke, The Late Late Show with James Corden, and the BET Awards.

Originally from the Dallas area, Chad trained as a gymnast before discovering dance in college. After building experience in Texas, he moved to Los Angeles and signed with MTA as a dancer. An internship during the pandemic later led to an assistant position and, eventually, a move into talent representation. Having experienced the industry as both a dancer and an agent, Chad is passionate about helping the next generation prepare for professional opportunities. His approach emphasizes intentional training, clear communication, strong submission materials, and helping dancers recognize and develop the qualities that make them distinctive.

CONNECT WITH CHAD GEIGER
Instagram: @chad_geiger
Instagram: @mtaagency

Recording / Interview Date: October 20, 2025

EPISODE SUMMARY
What helps a dancer build a career that lasts? Join Menina Fortunato on the red carpet at Avalon Hollywood for the 2025 Industry Dance Awards, where conversations with performers, choreographers, educators, and industry leaders go beyond the spotlight to explore the work, relationships, and resilience behind a life in dance.

From embracing your individuality to asking for help and protecting your reputation, this special episode brings together practical lessons for dancers, parents, teachers, and dance-industry professionals. Guests reflect on setbacks, creative opportunities, social media, and the importance of being someone others want to work with. Ian Eastwood champions uniqueness, Travis Wall speaks about seeking support, and Denise Wall shares perspective on learning through challenges.

At the heart of the evening is Dancers Against Cancer. Tia Stokes, Jocelyn Basham, and Noah Lands bring the conversation back to community, compassion, and supporting dance families affected by cancer. Alongside career advice and personal stories, these interviews capture the projects and priorities guests shared on the night of the event.

Whether you work in dance or simply love the art form, step behind the awards for an honest look at what sustains this community: purposeful work, human connection, and the courage to keep growing.

SHOW NOTES
00:00 Red carpet highlights and welcome
01:59 Tia Stokes: Authenticity and resilience
03:31 Jocelyn Basham: The power of human connection
07:09 Enola Bédard: Enjoying the journey
12:40 Protecting yourself as an artist
15:10 Travis Wall: The courage to ask for help
18:03 Noah Lands: The story behind Dancers Against Cancer
22:29 Denise Wall: Learning from setbacks
32:04 Why your reputation matters
32:59 Brooke Lipton: Dance and television
45:24 Social media as your future résumé
47:15 Ian Eastwood: Embracing your individuality
54:38 Blake McGrath: Family and purpose
1:03:37 Building a lasting dance career
1:10:55 Bringing character to your movement

ABOUT INDUSTRY DANCE AWARDS
The Industry Dance Awards celebrates the people shaping dance and supports Dancers Against Cancer. This red carpet special brings together artists, educators, and advocates to share career lessons and highlight the importance of supporting dance families affected by cancer.

CONNECT WITH INDUSTRY DANCE AWARDS & DANCERS AGAINST CANCER
Industry Dance Awards: https://www.industrydanceawards.com
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/industrydanceawards/
Dancers Against Cancer: https://imadanceragainstcancer.org
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/imadanceragainstcancer/
The Business of Dance: https://www.bizofdance.com/thepodcast

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Interview Date: September 13, 2026

EPISODE SUMMARY
Vancouver-born dancer, choreographer, and teacher Travis Lim joins Menina Fortunato to share his journey from childhood competitions and Michael Jackson-inspired solos to UCLA and professional dance work in Los Angeles. With credits including Lisa of BLACKPINK and Hollywood Arts, Travis offers an honest look at the artistic growth, relationships, and practical skills involved in building a career beyond the competition stage.

Travis reflects on the value of his UCLA dance education while explaining what it did not teach him about the business of working professionally. He discusses his family’s investment of approximately $400,000 CAD and the difference between developing as an artist and preparing to earn a living. The conversation also explores how he uses AI in his creative work, moves through perfectionism and comparison, and approaches projects with curiosity and a willingness to keep learning.

During the dancer Q&A, Travis shares his perspective on networking, direct bookings, choosing an agency, communicating with agents, and showing up confidently in auditions. He also discusses developing an individual style, making choices about competition and professional work, and finding time to recover. This episode is perfect for aspiring professional dancers, dance parents weighing college options, and competition dancers ready to understand what comes next.

SHOW NOTES
(00:51) – Introducing Travis Lim and his journey into professional dance
(03:44) – Childhood training, early competitions, and Michael Jackson’s influence
(07:29) – Moving to Los Angeles and choosing UCLA for dance
(13:43) – What his dance degree did not teach about the industry
(17:48) – Reflecting on a $400,000 CAD education investment
(22:01) – Using AI to support creative work and organize ideas
(28:46) – Working through perfectionism, comparison, and hesitation to create
(34:36) – Dancing with Lisa of BLACKPINK and learning from her professionalism
(36:28) – Behind the scenes of A Week Away and Hollywood Arts
(42:49) – Why networking and relationships matter for direct bookings
(45:59) – Choosing MSA and building communication with your agents
(50:49) – Standing out in auditions with confidence and personal strengths
(52:50) – Developing your own style while learning from other dancers
(59:24) – Weighing competition dance against a growing professional career
(62:36) – Recovery, downtime, and maintaining a life outside dance

ABOUT TRAVIS LIM
Travis Lim is a professional dancer, choreographer, artist, and teacher from Vancouver, Canada, based in Los Angeles. He began as a competitive dancer and freestyler, earning international recognition through the competition circuit and appearances on NBC’s World of Dance and Canada’s Got Talent. He moved to Los Angeles to attend UCLA, where he earned a Bachelor of Arts in Dance before continuing to build his professional career.

His film and television experience includes Hollywood Arts, A Week Away: The Series, and Lego Friends: The Musical with Kenny Ortega. Travis has also danced with artists including Lisa of BLACKPINK, Victoria Justice, Machine Gun Kelly, DPR IAN, Paris Hilton, and AJ McLean. Alongside his professional work, he teaches and shares his approach to training, choreography, and artistic development. Drawing on his background in freestyle, crew training, and choreography, he encourages dancers to develop their individuality while continuing to learn from different styles and experiences.

CONNECT WITH TRAVIS LIM
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/travylim/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@travylim

Interview Date: August 30, 2026
Episode Summary
In Episode 149 of The Business of Dance Podcast, host Menina Fortunato sits down with Los Angeles-based choreographer, movement director, and performer Noelle Marsh. Noelle traces her path from a small dance studio in North Carolina to the world stage, beginning with dance at age three, competing nationally, and appearing on So You Think You Can Dance, which became her gateway into the industry. She opens up about assisting Mia Michaels, being mentored by Brian Friedman, and choreographing and later performing alongside Tate McRae. Noelle also shares what it was like dancing in the Thriller sequence of the Michael Jackson biopic and the emotional weight of stepping into that legacy. The conversation explores her transition from performer to creative lead, moving fluidly between dancing and choreography, the fear and freedom of rejection, and why she believes people feel your thoughts more than your words. The episode closes with a mentee Q&A about authenticity, standing out in the room, building connections, and navigating today's social-media-driven industry.
Shownotes
00:50 – Introducing guest Noelle Marsh
03:10 – Growing up dancing in small-town North Carolina
04:33 – Getting the call to assist Mia Michaels
07:00 – Moving to Los Angeles with no plan and no backup
10:33 – First booking: the Oscars with Adam Shankman
12:42 – Building a relationship with Brian Friedman
15:07 – Choreographing and later dancing for Tate McRae
19:20 – Dancing in the Thriller sequence of the Michael Jackson biopic
24:04 – Transitioning from performer to choreographer
27:00 – Winning Every Single Step and gaining creative confidence
29:48 – Balancing dancing and choreography today
32:37 – Authenticity, thoughts over words, and reframing rejection
36:56 – Mentee Q&A: connections, standing out, and social media's role today
Biography
Noelle Marsh is a Los Angeles-based choreographer, movement director, and performer whose career moves across contemporary dance, pop culture, film, television, and brand work. After growing up in North Carolina, she appeared on So You Think You Can Dance, assisted Mia Michaels, and became part of the original company of Shaping Sound.
As a performer, Noelle has worked with artists including Beyoncé, Taylor Swift, Jennifer Lopez, Dua Lipa, Tate McRae, Halsey, Mariah Carey, Gwen Stefani, and Katy Perry. Her choreography and movement-direction work includes projects for Tate McRae, The Voice, and campaigns for Bose, McDonald's, Motorola, and DSW.
Connect with Noelle
Instagram — @noellemarsh