The Good, The Bad & The Rugby: Australia & New Zealand

The All Blacks lost the second test in Cape Town but were they actually that bad?

Andy Rowe is joined by former All Blacks captain and two-time Rugby World Cup winner Kieran Read to break down a game that turned on two minutes at the start and an aerial battle the All Blacks still can't win.

Read explains the untidy exit that had New Zealand seven points down inside two minutes, why the Springboks changed their defensive picture (14 in the line, nobody hunting the ruck) and what that means for the way the All Blacks attack. Plus the accuracy numbers: South Africa took 4.8 points from every 22 entry, New Zealand just 2.8 from nine.

There's the 2009 parallel (Matfield, box kicks and the series that changed how New Zealand played the game) and why the All Blacks are still catching high balls the old-school way. Pieter-Steph du Toit's 100th test. Then there's Rassie. The suit and tie, the team sheet handed over half an hour before kickoff, the F-bombs in the press conference and the complaint that the All Blacks are planting seeds in the media (from the man who put out an hour-long video on the referees during the Lions series). Read's take: "coaches have been doing this for a long time, but Rassie is the absolute king of it." Plus the scrum row it all came from: "we're not walking around, we're scrumming." And what changes for the third test, including Sam Darry, a six-two bench and where Rieko Ioane fits.

Over the Tasman, the Wallabies win 27-21 in Argentina, Les Kiss loosens the structure, and Joseph-Aukuso Suaalii starts on the bench — would you put him on the All Blacks wing to catch our high balls?

This episode is brought to you by Gallagher Insurance, your trusted insurance broker. The Gallagher Fearless Player of the Week goes to Leroy Carter.

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The All Blacks have gone to Ellis Park and won five tries to one and Marshy was standing in the middle of it.

This week Andy is joined by Justin Marshall live from Johannesburg, still dusty, still 30 years on from '96, and Kieran Read in studio after a 3am alarm and a duvet on the couch with his boy. They break down how the All Blacks were under the pump for 40 minutes and still walked off with a scoreline that flattered them, the three unnoticed effort plays that swung the whole test, and why nobody in that squad celebrated like the job was done.

Then Marshy finally does some homework and brings in former Springbok World Cup winning captain John Smit, who watched from the stands next to Francois Louw. He's honest about what he saw, the scrum that should have won it, the unforced errors he hasn't seen from this Springbok side in years, and what Rassie might do in Cape Town. He also explains what this tour has done to South Africa: green shirts every Friday, nothing getting done, and for the first time in the country's broadcasting history, more people watching rugby than football.

Plus: the points-per-22-entry stat the coaches are obsessed with, why Fabian Holland has become crucial, whether George Bower has forced a start, and a proper appreciation for Matt Carley telling the TMO no.

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Three tests to go. How good.

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📑CHAPTERS

00:00 Welcome — Marshy in Joburg, Reado in studio
00:58 "The most amazing feeling" — Marshy at Ellis Park
02:48 3am alarm, duvet on the couch, watching with the boy
04:11 Why this tour has brought back the old-school tours
06:07 The 1996 generation gap (and the frosted tips)
07:50 Why the All Blacks didn't celebrate
08:39 Under the pump — how were we only one point down?
10:10 The points the Springboks left out there
12:33 The three effort plays that swung the test
13:08 Jordie Barrett's hand of God
14:57 Altitude, fatigue and a spongy Ellis Park
16:20 Fearless Player of the Week, brought to you by Gallagher
18:12 The 22-entry stat the coaches are obsessed with
21:21 Why the Bok ball carriers are so hard to stop
23:40 GUEST: Springbok World Cup winning captain John Smit
25:47 Smit on the first half: "the scoreboard didn't reflect it"
28:05 What can Rassie actually change for Cape Town?
29:52 Do the Boks go back to the old formula?
32:44 "It's psychotic" — what this series is doing to South Africa
37:10 Respect for the haka: the quietest Ellis Park's ever been
38:58 Smit's message to the Boks: "we haven't become a bad team in one day"
40:56 Reacting to Smit — a nation in mourning
41:20 "We've stuck our foot all the way in their house"
42:47 Why Andy still isn't confident
44:18 Fabian Holland's engine and Tupou Vaa'i at lock
45:51 The front row — does Bower start in Cape Town?
48:42 The Lions game and managing bodies through the tour
49:41 Matt Carley, the TMO, and letting the game flow
53:49 Wrap
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Justin Marshall joins us live from Pretoria, three tour games deep, one week out from Ellis Park and the mood in South Africa is exactly as cocky as you'd fear. Andy, Kieran Read and Marshy get into the arrogance ("if the All Blacks draw the series, that's a result for THEM"), why South African rugby is booming from schoolboy level up, and the recruitment problem that's got them worried about 13-year-olds on retainers.

Then the serious business: how the All Blacks are actually tracking after three from three, the injury watch on Will Jordan, Cam Roigard and Damian McKenzie, the loose forward puzzle, whether lineout height should be driving selection, why Argentina handed us the blueprint for beating the Boks and why a Springbok side that's short of minutes might be more vulnerable at altitude than anyone's saying.

Plus the Gallagher Fearless Player of the Week

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📑CHAPTERS
00:00 Intro — Marshall live from Pretoria
01:28 "Can the All Blacks beat the Springboks?" — the arrogance question
03:09 Cape Town to the Highveld: what the crowds are like
03:45 The Crusader who reckoned altitude was no problem
04:59 Why South African rugby is absolutely fizzing
06:58 What NZ can learn — NPC crowds and grassroots passion
08:41 The lost art of the tour
09:22 Is South Africa now ahead of us on depth?
11:33 13-year-olds on retainers: South Africa's recruitment worry
13:11 Three from three — how are the All Blacks tracking?
13:26 Injury watch: Will Jordan, Cam Roigard, Damian McKenzie
14:40 Managing a 44-man squad, and Rennie's "not satisfied" message
16:56 Finding the width: the attacking blueprint
18:24 Beating the blitz — why unpredictability is everything
20:35 The loose forward puzzle: Segner, Lakai, Tupou Vaa'i at 6
22:06 6-2 bench, and three wingers for two spots
24:13 Should lineout height decide selection?
25:52 Gallagher Fearless Player of the Week: Ruben Love
29:58 Kolisi out — who jackals for the Boks now?
30:40 Segner's answer to the Kirifi debate
33:01 Are the Springboks undercooked?
35:25 The prep gap — and why Read isn't buying it
36:25 Argentina handed us the blueprint
37:48 Altitude, fatigue and the hurt locker
40:28 The mental side of altitude: "your body says you can't go on"
42:39 Slowing the game down, and what a captain can do about it
44:17 Final word: "This All Blacks team can beat the world champions"
46:17 Outro

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Email the team at: info@goodbadrugby.com

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30 years ago the All Blacks won their first test series on South African soil.

Andy Rowe sits down with two men who were there: Frank Bunce and Justin Marshall. They relive the 1992 return tour after apartheid, the intimidation of Ellis Park, Jonah Lomu's 1995 World Cup, and the week in Pretoria where Sean Fitzpatrick told the team: "There's no way we're going to Ellis Park with the series on the line."

Plus: the Michael Brial fight, the famous "too old, too slow, two tries" headline, Bunce's legendary partnership with Walter Little, why the All Blacks haven't settled a midfield since Ma'a Nonu and Conrad Smith, and whether this All Blacks side can win the series again.

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00:00 Intro: two members of the '96 All Blacks in studio

00:28 1992: the first tour back after apartheid

02:19 Danie Gerber: greatest centre ever?

03:56 Ellis Park: walking into the lion's den

07:31 1995: Jonah Lomu changes rugby forever

11:58 Running out for the '95 World Cup final and Mandela

14:25 Turning the page to the 1996 tour

15:13 The midweekers: why a squad of 36 won the series

17:03 Tri Nations battles and Bunce's winner in Brisbane

19:28 "We win it in Pretoria" — Fitzpatrick's message

22:16 Facing that Springbok side

24:07 John Preston, Zinzan's drop goal and the pivotal moments

26:23 The goal-line stand

28:40 The toughest Springboks Bunce ever faced

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The All Blacks squad to tour South Africa is out and the boys have questions. Seven wingers but no out-and-out fullback, only three halfbacks, five injury-prone locks, and Damian McKenzie named at first five but destined for the back field. Justin Marshall and Kieran Read drop into what it's actually like touring the Republic: altitude, boot parties, beer cans at the bus, and why four Tests in a row is like playing four finals.

Plus: Ethan Blackadder back from the wilderness, how to build the loose trio around Ardie Savea, the unlucky ones (Du'Plessis Kirifi, Noah Hotham), what happens if Richie Mo'unga gets the call, and how you even prep a squad for games every three days.

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📑CHAPTERS

00:00 Intro
00:31 First reactions to the squad
02:31 Seven wingers — so who plays fullback?
04:12 Only three halfbacks: Ratima on the bench all tour?
05:02 George Bell and the fourth hooker call
06:31 The lock stocks: injury concerns
08:04 Bench impact — matching the Bomb Squad
10:20 6-2 split or backline flexibility?
15:18 Ethan Blackadder back from the wilderness
17:44 We need our best ball carriers carrying
20:13 Harvey Norman Next Gen Moment: Timoci Tavatavanawai
22:07 The unlucky ones: Kirifi & Hotham
25:44 What the selectors want from their loose forwards
30:54 Building the game plan around Ardie Savea
34:05 The Josh Jacomb surprise
36:48 What if Richie Mo'unga gets the call?
37:58 Playing in South Africa: altitude & atmosphere
41:46 Touring the Republic: boot parties & hospitality
44:52 Games every three days — how do you prep?
46:48 Where should the Test team play? Tour strategy
49:11 First Test excitement & why the timing is perfect
50:26 Wrap-up
─────────────────────────────

📩 GOT A QUESTION FOR THE LADS?
Email the team at: info@goodbadrugby.com

─────────────────────────────

📲 FOLLOW THE GOOD, THE BAD & THE RUGBY AUSTRALIA & NEW ZEALAND
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