The ReMembering and ReEnchanting Podcast

A mathematician sets out to participate in the study of evolution... and ends up engaging in some fascinating research about social cooperation and the queerness of evolution!    In this episode, Sara Jolena sits down with her old college friend Ben Allen, a mathematician whose work models how cooperation evolves — from iron-sharing bacteria to communal-nesting birds. They consider what this research might illuminate about cooperation in human communities. They then turn towards some of Ben's current research on queerness in evolution. Same-sex behavior has now been documented in more than 1,500 species... and it just keeps getting more interesting! 

Key Topics & Timestamps
00:00 — Intro: welcome to ReMembering and ReEnchanting
01:05 — Meet Ben Allen: mathematician, old friend, and a researcher on evolution 
02:56 — From pure math to evolutionary biology: how Ben's path unfolded
04:26 — Why organisms cooperate — and why "survival of the fittest" is an incomplete story
06:27 — The bacteria that share iron with their neighbors
08:18 — Modeling evolution mathematically: networks, neighbors, and cooperation
09:13 — From microbes to mammals: what changes (and what doesn't) when culture enters the picture
11:03 — Local connection as a strategy for large-scale engagement (including activism)
12:52 — Other paths to cooperation: kin selection, reciprocity, and reputation
14:26 — What evolution actually means: reproduction, inheritance, and mutation
16:53 — A parallel to religious traditions: continuity and change in tension
17:42 — What "reproduction" really means across the tree of life (sexual, asexual, horizontal gene transfer)
19:37 — What biologists actually mean by "male" and "female" — and why the definition breaks down
23:04 — Evolution "finds a way": clonal fish, sex-changing clownfish, and the limits of a human template
25:45 — Sex beyond reproduction: play, pleasure, and social bonding across species
26:43 — The 2019 paper reframing same-sex behavior in animals
31:28 — Ben's current research: could early marine life not even "see" sex at all?
33:15 — Deep-sea squid, imperfect filtering, and why indiscriminate mating can be an evolutionary advantage
36:37 — Two evolutionary strategies: cost of mating vs. population density
38:36 — Connection, yearning, and sociability across species
41:10 — Individual variation: why generalizing about any species misses the truth
42:16 — "A very queer evolutionary story"
43:20 — Darwin's Victorian assumptions that we are still unlearning
44:40 — The perspective of the scientist shifts the questions and analysis that the scientist does. We need many, many different perspectives for these big complex questions! 
45:31 — Situated knowledge, Donna Haraway, and the case for multiple vantage points
46:23 — Closing reflections and thanks
Ben Allen is a Professor of Mathematics at Emmanuel College, Boston, MA. Their research focuses on mathematical modeling of evolution—in particular the evolution of social (other-directed) behavior. Their work has appeared in Nature, Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, and The Atlantic. 
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Music Title: Both of Us
Music by: madiRFAN 
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In this episode, we are uplifting some of the ideas in Elspeth Hay’s remarkable book,   Feed Us with Trees: Nuts and the Future of Food.  After starting with Sara Jolena offering a summary of some of the big ideas in the book, we move into a conversation with author Elspeth Hay and a few of the many people whom Elspeth has mentioned in the book: Ron Reed, Karuk tribal member and cultural biologist; Joanna Brooks, settler scholar and author of Why We Left; and Gale Pettifer, commoner and scholar of the New Forest in England. Together they trace a set of histories that turn out to be deeply entangled: Indigenous land dispossession in California, the enclosure of the English commons, the suppression of cultural burning, the erasure of ancestral foodways — and the folk songs, forest laws, and buried memories that survived all of it. 

Timestamps
0:00  —  Welcome & introduction: Sara Jolena introduces the episode, inspired by Elspeth Hay’s book Feed Us with Trees, and the “no farm, no food” myth it challenges.
2:51  —  Guest introductions: Elspeth introduces Ron Reed (Karuk Nation, cultural biologist), Joanna Brooks (Why We Left), and Gale Pettifer (New Forest commoner and commons scholar).
5:44  —  Ron Reed’s opening story: childhood memories of harvesting acorns, mushrooms, and salmon; the Klamath Dam removal; and the ongoing fight to restore Indigenous fire practices with public trust objectives.
9:20  —  Gale Pettifer on the New Forest: a thousand years of contested common rights, Norman forest law, and what it means to still practice ancient commoning in the 21st century.
12:58  —  Joanna Brooks on settler scholarship and song: tracing her European ancestry through folk ballads, a grandmother’s lullaby, and a plate of hazelnuts at the British Museum that the curators couldn’t explain.
18:29  —  Fire across continents: Elspeth connects her experience of gorse burning debates in the New Forest to Ron’s work on cultural burning — the same argument, on opposite sides of the Atlantic.
30:58  —  Dragons, sacred fire, and colonial memory: a discussion of how fire moved from sacred to feared in Anglo-Saxon and English tradition, illustrated by the New Forest dragon legend and the introduction of Christianity.
34:31  —  Songs of grief and displacement: Joanna traces the emotional record of enclosure through English murder ballads — songs about hazel trees, beaver hats, and families starving off the land — and what they reveal about why colonial settlers “lost their minds.”
43:12  —  Magna Carta, common law, and the 1877 New Forest Act: Gale traces how brutal Norman forest law paradoxically became the foundation of commoners’ rights, and how public outcry saved the New Forest from privatization.
47:33  —  The allotment parallel: Elspeth draws a striking connection between English allotment gardens and the U.S. federal allotment system used to break up Indigenous tribal lands — the same word, the same colonial logic, on both sides of the ocean.
1:10:42  —  Cycles of colonization and reverse transmission: Sara Jolena traces how colonial practices — from plantation timekeeping to fire suppression — were exported back to Europe, and the importance of distinguishing imperial forces from common people’s forces within every culture.
1:16:11  —  Closing round: guests share what is shifting now — prescribed fire training in Wellfleet, MA; intergenerational transfer of fire ecology knowledge; the joy of reconnecting with the New Forest through free-roaming ponies — and an invitation to listeners to bring these ideas into their communities.
Elspeth Hay
Book: Feed us with trees
Website
Bio
Insta

Ron Reed
Article about Ron Reed - How Karuk ceremonial leader Ron Reed used Western science to take down the Klamath dams
Interview featuring Ron - Fire is Food: A Virtual Brown Bag Discussion with Ron Reed and Kari Norgaard

Joanna Brooks
Book: Why We Left 
Website
Bio
Linkedin

Gale Pettifer 
Linkedin
Bio

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Music Title: Both of Us
Music by: madiRFAN 
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In this episode of the Remembering and ReEnchanting podcast, Sara Jolena Wolcott sits down with filmmaker and spiritual innovator Nova Scott James to trace the profound arc of her film journey.

The journey begins with an exploration of Nova’s origins—from the influence of Harlem and childhood memories to the transformative power of cinema as a spiritual practice. We delve into the creation of her film 'Wild Darlings Sing the Blues' and the personal healing journey that informed her creative vision.

The conversation then transitions into a deep dive into the collective’s latest work: a land-based healing documentary. Nova shares the visceral experience of honoring ancestral land, navigating the energetic weight of filming on former plantations in Virginia, and the serendipitous rituals guided by spirits. This is a story of building a Black queer women’s collective through trust, patience, and the labor of collective transformation.
00:00 - Podcast Intro
01:30 - Introduction to the Wild Darlings Collective
03:18 - Exploring Origin Stories and Childhood Memories
07:56 - Understanding Lineage and Spiritual Innovation
17:06 - Cinema as a Temple: The Spirituality of Film
25:05 - The Healing Journey Behind 'Wild Darlings Sing the Blues'
28:19 - Healing Through Psychedelic Therapy
30:13 - The Birth of a Creative Vision
33:34 - Exploring Ancestral Lineage
37:11 - Confronting Family History and Trauma
40:06 - Introduction to Day 2 Recording
40:28 - Introduction to the journey of creating a land-based healing documentary
42:33 - The initial visions and spiritual downloads that inspired the film
44:38 - The healing and spiritual practices of the Darlings Collective
46:48 - Building community through workshops and shared spiritual work
49:23 - The significance of land and spirits in the collective’s rituals
52:43 - Challenges faced with facilitators and group dynamics
56:58 - Rebuilding after adversity and seeking an elder for guidance
1:01:13 - Connecting with land in Virginia and the impact of sacred sites
1:05:38 - The serendipitous process of land selection and the role of spirits
1:12:28 - Filming on plantations: rituals, ceremonies, and the energetic environment
1:25:30 - The immersive experience of land-based ceremonies and prayers
1:32:48 - Observations of healing and collective transformation during the process
1:35:28 - The importance of compassion in ancestral healing work
1:38:38 - Personal reflections on integrating trauma and ancestral memories
1:41:48 - Deepening trust and love for the land, spiritual practice, and creativity
1:43:58 - Final thoughts: upcoming release and ways to support the project

Movie Trailer: Wild Darlings Sing the Blues 
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Music Title: Both of Us
Music by: madiRFAN 
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In this special episode of the Remembering and Reenchanting podcast, hostess Reverend Sara Jolena Wolcott is joined by her friend, former student and collaborator, Gayano Shaw, for a reflection on the year of 2025. Going beyond our normal format where Sara Jolena uplifts other people’s work or shares some of her own, she invites Gayano to help her hold her own reflection. The process is loosely modeled after Sara Jolena’s circular time rituals.

Standing in the beginnings of 2026, Sara and Gayano look back at a year marked by profound personal and collective shifts—from the literal birth of a new family member to the mourning of six significant deaths in six months as well as immense political change. They explore what it means to "take down the altar" in times of upheaval of cosmovision, the power of indigenous-led rematriation, and letting life help us learn to refine our own practice.

Timestamps
00:00:03 – Introduction

00:01:40 – Purpose of Reflection: Sara explains her "Circular Time" reflection process, which she has practiced for eight years.

00:04:01 – Gayano shares her experience with Sara's circular calendars and the somatic nature of her teaching.

00:08:52 – January 2025: The start of the month-by-month and thematic look back at the past year.

00:10:46 – Family and Birth: Reflection on the birth of Krissy's grandchild and the "liminal space" of birthing.

00:13:15 – Work and Radical HR: Discussion of Krissy's new full-time job and the implementation of a three-month paid leave policy.

00:15:04 – Environmental Impact: Reflections on the Los Angeles fires and lessons from previous disasters like the fire in Paradise.

00:17:15 – Political and Indigenous Learnings: Sara discusses the presidential inauguration and learning from indigenous elder Pat McCabe.

00:37:26 – Cultural Revitalization: Observations from a gathering focused on indigenous healing and cultural strength.

00:58:29 – Public Speaking and Learning: Sara reflects on her growth and the challenges of stepping onto larger stages.

01:06:17 – Consistency and Improvement: Reviewing the year's progress in writing and teaching the "Remembering" course.

01:21:17 – Rituals of Death and Grief: Discussion on the importance of creating authentic rituals for death and loss.

01:31:30 – Societal Structures: Reflections on binary thinking, Christian nationalism, and the lack of processing time in modern society.

01:47:35 – Personal Challenges: Sara shares struggles regarding her mother’s care and the loss of insurance due to climate risks.

01:56:00 – Closing Thoughts: Final reflections on the richness of the current times and an invitation to "hold those seeds with care".

More about Gayano Shaw:
The Center for Nonviolent Communication
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Music Title: Both of Us
Music by: madiRFAN 
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In this episode, Sara Jolena talks with Meda Dewitt, a Lingit traditional healer, ethno-herbalist, educator, and artist from the Tlingit culture. Together, they explore themes of the perception of time in western and Indigenous cultures, the importance of storytelling, and the impact of seasonal changes on life. This includes the contrast between Native time and what Meda refers to as "managed time," emphasizing the need for balance.   The episode concludes with reflections on the personal and the collective in a rapidly changing world.

Subsections
00:00 - Introducing Meda DeWitt
02:11 - Cultural Identity and Language
05:40 - Understanding Time in Indigenous Cultures (with a focus on Tlingit)
10:09 - The Nature of Storytelling and Memory
18:40 - Cycles of Life and Nature
25:31 - Native Time vs. Clock Time
27:47 - Navigating Between Clock Time and Organic Time
31:04 - The Impact of Managed Time on Well-being
35:28 - The Reckoning of Time in a Capitalistic Society
38:12 - Finding Balance in a Modern Context
43:05 Embracing Mortality and the Value of Time
51:39 - Moving Between Times
Websites:
Wilderness.org/imago
SanctuaryAnimism.org
medaforalaska.com
Facebook.com/sanctuaryanimism
YouTube.com/@sanctuaryanimism

Note: Tlingit culture is a matrilineal society from what is now referred to as Southeastern Alaska.  "Tlingit" means "people of the tides." Alaska has 229 federally recognized Alaska Native tribes, more than any other U.S. state, representing distinct indigenous cultures including the Yup'ik, Inupiaq, Athabascan, Tlingit, Haida, Eyak, and Aleut (Unangax/Sugpiaq).    These peoples are deeply tied to their ecosystems.  The major Alaskan ecosystems include: tundra, taiga (boreal forest), coastal rainforests, marine ecosystems (including the Gulf of Alaska, the Bering Sea, Chukchi Sea and the Aleutian Islands), mountains/glaciers; and wetlands and freshwaters. 
The image used is from Fairbanks, Alaska, on the winter solstice. It depicts the short height and the narrow range of the sun on the winter solstice, when Fairbanks receives 3.5-4 hours of sunlight.  Photo: Todd Paris courtesy of University of Alaska Fairbanks.
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Music Title: Both of Us
Music by: madiRFAN 
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