No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp

Do you feel the weight of climate dread—and wonder whether hope is still intellectually honest?

Acclaimed science fiction writer Kim Stanley Robinson joins Lee C. Camp to name our shared fear about the future without surrendering to despair. Drawing from ⁠The Ministry for the Future⁠, Robinson offers a sober, deeply hopeful vision of change, one rooted not in heroics or denial, but in ordinary people, communal action, and the slow work of making things better. Together they explore how science, faith, and moral imagination can help us live well, even in a warming world.

Key Ideas:


Hope Without Illusion Robinson shows how genuine hope can coexist with fear, grounding optimism in science, collective action, and moral resolve rather than denial.


Ordinary People Matter History often turns not on heroes or villains, but on everyday people, bureaucrats, scientists, neighbors, who do the right thing at critical moments.


Utopia as Process A better future isn’t a flawless destination, but a continual movement toward less suffering, greater justice, and deeper solidarity.


The Sacredness of the Biosphere Care for the planet is not just technical or political work, but a form of devotion rooted in humility, wonder, and reverence for life.


Community Over Individualism Human flourishing depends on shared systems, food, labor, science, and governance that remind us how deeply we rely on one another.

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠

⁠Show Notes, Resources and Transcript⁠⁠ for abridged episode with Kim Stanley Robinson⁠

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⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join NSE+⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.

No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness.

Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@nosmallendeavor⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@leeccamp ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠
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This is our unabridged interview with Paul Rosolie.

He’s been dragged through the Amazon on the back of a giant anaconda, stood in seventy-foot flames trying to save burning animals, and slept on jungle floors for decades to protect a forest most of us will never see.

Conservationist and author Paul Rosolie joins Lee C. Camp to tell the extraordinary story of how a dyslexic kid from Brooklyn followed a calling into the Amazon rainforest — and gave his life to protecting it. From near-death encounters and viral moments to faith, sacrifice, and hope, this conversation explores what it truly takes to change the world and why the future of human flourishing is inseparable from the fate of the wild.

Key Ideas:

-Answer the Call: Paul’s life shows how vocation often begins not with credentials, but with saying yes to the next faithful step placed before you.

-Love What You Protect: Conservation, Paul argues, is not driven by ideology but by intimacy — knowing rivers, animals, and people well enough to fight for them.

-Stay Human in Crisis: Facing ecological collapse without despair requires resisting cynicism and choosing hope as a disciplined, courageous act.

-Courage Is Costly: Following a true calling often demands sacrifice — financial, relational, and personal — but meaning grows precisely in that cost.

-The World Is Connected: The Amazon is not “out there”; it regulates climate, water, and life everywhere, binding New York, Bangalore, and the jungle canopy together.

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Show Notes, Resources and Transcript⁠⁠ for abridged episode with Paul Rosolie⁠

Thank you to our sponsors:

Boll and Branch: Get 20% off plus free shipping by visiting ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BollAndBranch.com/NSE⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join NSE+⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.

No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness.

Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@nosmallendeavor⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@leeccamp ⁠⁠⁠⁠
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What does it actually look like to take responsibility when you’ve shaped a culture that harmed people? Is saying “I’m sorry” enough?

This week on The Subtext, we revisit the cultural reckoning around America’s Next Top Model and ask what meaningful accountability looks like for those who shaped, and benefited from, harmful beauty standards. Is acknowledging harm enough, or does repentance require repair? Turning to the story of Zacchaeus in Luke 19, we explore a biblical model of costly repentance that doesn’t just confess wrongdoing but restores what was taken.

Things we mentioned in this episode:

Ben Cohen on No Small Endeavor

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He’s been dragged through the Amazon on the back of a giant anaconda, stood in seventy-foot flames trying to save burning animals, and slept on jungle floors for decades to protect a forest most of us will never see.

Conservationist and author Paul Rosolie joins Lee C. Camp to tell the extraordinary story of how a dyslexic kid from Brooklyn followed a calling into the Amazon rainforest — and gave his life to protecting it. From near-death encounters and viral moments to faith, sacrifice, and hope, this conversation explores what it truly takes to change the world and why the future of human flourishing is inseparable from the fate of the wild.

Key Ideas:


Answer the Call Paul’s life shows how vocation often begins not with credentials, but with saying yes to the next faithful step placed before you.


Love What You Protect Conservation, Paul argues, is not driven by ideology but by intimacy — knowing rivers, animals, and people well enough to fight for them.


Stay Human in Crisis Facing ecological collapse without despair requires resisting cynicism and choosing hope as a disciplined, courageous act.


Courage Is Costly Following a true calling often demands sacrifice — financial, relational, and personal — but meaning grows precisely in that cost.


The World Is Connected The Amazon is not “out there”; it regulates climate, water, and life everywhere, binding New York, Bangalore, and the jungle canopy together.

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Show Notes, Resources and Transcript⁠⁠ for abridged episode with Paul Rosolie

Thank you to our sponsors:

Boll and Branch: Get 20% off plus free shipping by visiting ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BollAndBranch.com/NSE⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join NSE+⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.

No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness.

Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@nosmallendeavor⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@leeccamp ⁠⁠⁠
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is our unabridged interview with Alexandra Solomon.

 Is your love life in need of a tune-up?  Just in time for Valentine's Day, renowned relationship expert Dr. Alexandra Solomon joins us to share powerful insights from her book, "Loving Bravely."  Discover how self-awareness and understanding your past can dramatically improve your present relationships.  Dr. Solomon unpacks the secrets to thriving intimacy, from mastering the art of apology to staying truly present with your partner.  Plus, get practical tools for navigating the inevitable challenges of long-term love.  Tune in for this insightful conversation that will empower you to build stronger, more fulfilling relationships.

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Show Notes, Resources and Transcript⁠⁠ for abridged episode with Alexandra Solomon

Thank you to our sponsors:

Boll and Branch: Get 20% off plus free shipping by visiting ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BollAndBranch.com/NSE⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join NSE+⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable.

No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness.

Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@nosmallendeavor⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@leeccamp ⁠⁠⁠
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices