The Quiet Warrior Podcast with Serena Low

There is a particular grief that comes with outgrowing the people who once matched your pace, and no one tells you it is allowed to hurt and be right at the same time. In this conversation, Serena Low sits down with executive coach and author Steve Barton, creator of the Game of Ten framework, to explore what happens when old friendships fall away, old certainties dissolve, and the question underneath it resurfaces — am I enough as I am, right now, before I fix any thing? Barton, who built a family flower business from $200,000 to $2 million before a mental health awakening changed the course of his life, shares the concept of compassionate detachment (which he calls Tenkaré) as a way to care fully without absorbing other people's pain, and explains why chasing perfection is, in his words, a cat chasing its own tail. This is a conversation for the reader still in the messy middle of becoming who they already are.
Questions Answered
What is the Game of Ten framework and what does it mean to "already be a 10"?
What is compassionate detachment, and why did Steve Barton coin the word Tenkaré?
Why do friendships and relationships fall away during a period of personal growth?
What is the difference between letting go of a person and letting go of a thought about that person?
Are introversion and extroversion fixed traits, or learned responses to early conditioning?
Why does the chase for perfection never resolve?
How can helpers, coaches, and therapists avoid taking on other people's pain as their own?
Key Takeaways
Outgrowing someone you love does not make you disloyal. It means you grew, and the grief that comes with that is allowed to exist without being fixed.
Regrets and mistakes are not identity. The exhausting work of trying to earn approval assumes the two are the same thing - they never were.
Compassionate detachment is not coldness. It is the boundary that lets a coach, therapist, or caregiver keep showing up without absorbing what was never theirs to carry.
Introversion and extroversion were shaped early, in what got praised and what got silenced as a child; they are not fixed at birth.
Letting go is not about the person, the place, or what happened. It is about releasing the thoughts still looping about them, and doing it for yourself, not for their apology.
Perfectionism has no finish line because there was never a race. 
Chapters (approx.)
00:00 — Welcome and introduction to Steve Barton
01:20 — From the family flower shop to a $2 million business
04:14 — The awakening: therapy, mental health, and what changed
09:05 — When growth means people fall away
09:54 — The train analogy: still on board as people come and go
12:41 — Introducing the Game of Ten: you are the carrot, not the stick
14:59 — Why we're afraid to be loved, and how thoughts became identity
21:59 — Surrender and the hardest, most freeing thing: being yourself
24:26 — Introversion, extroversion, and how personality gets conditioned
27:16 — Compassionate detachment and the birth of "Tenkaré"
33:19 — Skill versus identity: why perfectionism never ends
36:37 — Awareness as the key that unlocks the chains
37:04 — Where to find Steve: website, book, and LinkedIn
39:31 — Closing thoughts
About Steve Barton
Steve Barton is an executive coach, author, and creator of the Game of Ten, an awareness-based framework that helps leaders operate with greater clarity, confidence, and performance. He brings over 47 years of real-world business experience, having grown a company from $200,000 to $2 million in annual revenue. His work blends practical business strategy with a deep understanding of human awareness, decision-making, and emotional intelligence. Steve is co-author of The Father, the Son, and the Aha Moment and is currently writing his next book on the mindset, emotional clarity, and inner alignment needed to succeed in both business and life.
If this conversation resonated with you and you want to learn more about reducing or ridding yourself of fear, self-doubt, guilt and shame and to learn more about The Game of Ten, schedule a Discovery Call with Steve at www.stevebartoncoaching.com.
About The Quiet Warrior Podcast
The Quiet Warrior Podcast is a show for introverted professional women navigating visibility, leadership, and career and personal growth.
If this episode resonated, please rate and review the show on your listening app. Your support helps more introverts become Quiet Warriors.
Work with Serena
Host Serena Low is a trauma-informed coach and former lawyer who brings lived experience to every conversation, meeting listeners at the edge of The Transition and guiding them towards clarity and congruence.
Book a paid Diagnostic Call with Serena to determine if your next career move is stay/go: https://calendly.com/serenalow/diagnostic-call

Work with Serena Low at serenalow.com.au. 
Loved this episode? Leave a review to help other Quiet Warriors find the show.
This episode was edited by Aura House Productions

There is a particular kind of stiffness that comes from believing your intellect is the only thing that will get you through. You put forward the version of yourself that has the answers, the version that never lets the mask slip, because somewhere along the way you learned that being seen as capable was the same thing as being safe. Then life takes the choice out of your hands. A cancer diagnosis. A five-year survival window. A 925-kilometer walk across France and Spain with nothing but a change of clothes and a set of questions you thought you had already answered.
This week's guest is Alexander Ee, a former lawyer, management consultant, and corporate real estate executive who left a decades-long career in the boardroom to walk the Camino de Santiago after losing his wife, Regina, to cancer. What began as an attempt to outrun grief became something closer to a reckoning: with the mask of competence he had worn since childhood, with what it means to let people see him without it, and with a small stone he almost didn't pick up. Alexander shares the story behind his book, A Glimpse of Heaven, and what quiet courage actually looks like when the applause isn't the point.
Questions Answered in This Episode
What is the Camino de Santiago, and why do people walk it after loss?
How do you know when you're performing competence instead of being yourself?
What does the "stone tradition" at Cruz de Ferro mean, and why is it hard to let go?
How does faith help someone process grief and rebuild a sense of purpose?
Why do quiet, retiring people sometimes step forward when it matters most?
What can someone navigating grief or a major life transition take away from this story?
Key Takeaways
The exhaustion of always having to look like you have the answers, and the relief of finally letting that go
Realizing that the friends who saw every flaw were the ones who made you feel most accepted
The strange, almost physical weight of carrying something you haven't admitted you need to release
Discovering that purpose doesn't arrive as a plan, it arrives as a talent you're willing to lend to someone else
Watching a quiet, retiring friend step into the spotlight exactly when the moment called for it, and realizing that same courage lives in all of us
Learning to take grief one day at a time, rather than trying to picture an entire life without the person in it
Notable Quote
"You can command your fingers to open, and then they don't."

Chapter Approximate Timestamps 
00:00 – Introduction to Alexander Ee
00:53 – From law to consulting to corporate real estate
02:08 – His wife Regina's cancer diagnosis and the decision to stay home 04:48 – Rediscovering faith through prayer and humility
08:27 – What really inspired the Camino de Santiago
11:34 – Dropping the mask: discovering he was "quite likable"
19:51 – The stone he almost didn't bring, and letting go at Cruz de Ferro
26:05 – How grief still resurfaces, and where he finds comfort
28:19 – Finding purpose through talents used for others
31:09 – Money, achievement, and mistaking identity for what doesn't last
36:23 – Turning an annual pilgrimage into a fundraiser
37:15 – Community, quiet courage, and the ethos of the Quiet Warrior
39:33 – The friend who stepped up when it mattered
42:12 – A message for anyone navigating grief or transition
43:34 – Alex’s book, A Glimpse of Heaven: Grief, Self and Community on the Camino

About the Guest
Alexander Ee is a former lawyer, management consultant, and corporate real estate executive based in Singapore. After the passing of his wife, Regina, he walked the 925-kilometer Camino de Santiago, an experience that led him to write A Glimpse of Heaven: Grief, Self and Community on the Camino, currently available in bookstores in Singapore. He has since completed the pilgrimage three times and now works for a Singapore charity, with this year's walk serving as a fundraiser.
About the Host Serena Low
I'm Serena Low, former lawyer turned Root-Cause Coach, and I work with professional women on one question: should you stay and rebuild, or leave on your own terms. It starts with one Diagnostic Call, where we get underneath the stress to what's actually driving it — the root cause beneath the symptoms. Book your call HERE.
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Share this episode with someone who’s walking through grief and transition.

Work with Serena Low at serenalow.com.au. 
Loved this episode? Leave a review to help other Quiet Warriors find the show.
This episode was edited by Aura House Productions

Jennifer Kornoely didn't choose to leave corporate. The choice was made for her.
She was meeting every goal, delivering every metric — and her manager let her go anyway. Because he could. A single mum with no severance, no safety net, and suddenly no income.
What she did next wasn't a triumphant pivot. It was a survival decision that slowly became something she chose.
In this episode, Jennifer shares how she went from real estate photographer who didn't know what she didn't know, to the founder of She Reads She Leads — an online book club and community for women who are done waiting for someone to hand them the financial and business knowledge they were never taught.
This conversation is for you if you've ever wondered: why does everyone else seem to know how this works — and why didn't anyone tell me?
What We Talk About
The moment everything was taken away 
Jennifer was performing well. She was hitting all her numbers. And she was still let go — because a man didn't like her and had the power to act on it. She talks honestly about what it feels like when your income, your health insurance, and your professional identity disappear overnight — and why this story is far more common than women are willing to admit.
What you don't know until you start 
Photography was the skill. But pricing, client contracts, pitching a major brokerage, knowing which clients to avoid — none of that came with the camera. Jennifer names the invisible gap between being brilliant at your craft and actually running a business. It's not a confidence gap. It's a knowledge gap. And no one hands you the curriculum.
How audiobooks in empty houses changed everything 
Doing solo real estate photography means hours of silence. Jennifer started filling that silence with personal finance audiobooks. Ideas took root. Conversations shifted. She started asking better questions of the women around her — and realizing she wasn't the only one hungry for this.
Why women need community — not just mentors 
There's a difference between learning from someone and learning with someone. Jennifer found that the real breakthroughs in her community happened not in the expert-to-student moments, but in the Zoom calls where a woman said I feel like I'm behind — and three other women immediately said you're not. Here's what I did.
Building a community as an introvert 
Jennifer didn't want to be center stage. She didn't want to be pitching to ten people a day. So she built something that fits who she actually is: smaller groups, intentional relationships, facilitated conversation rather than performance. She talks about the 30 seconds of discomfort at a networking event that leads to a one-on-one — and why that's a strategy, not just a consolation prize.
Women as multipliers 
When Jennifer says women don't just grow what they're given — they multiply it — she means it practically. Better investors. Better savers. Better negotiators. And yet: messaged from scarcity instead of abundance. Told to clip coupons while men are told to dominate markets. This conversation names that gap directly.
Why entrepreneurial thinking belongs to everyone — even if you love your job 
Jennifer makes a case that hits differently in this job market: don't wait until you need these skills to build them. If you lost your income tomorrow, would you know how to replace it? The answer to that question is worth sitting with.
Three Starter Books for Women and Money
Jennifer recommends these three books as the foundation - read all three before moving to investing or business finance.
The Financial Feminist — Tori Dunlap On gender inequality in money, and why financial messaging has always been different for women.
Rich AF — Vivian Tu On evolving from financial basics into wealth-building — from someone who spent years watching how high-net-worth people actually think and operate.
Get Good with Money — Tiffany Aliche On budgeting and tracking with intention, not shame. Because you can't improve what you don't understand.
All three are written by millennial women, all three are active on social media, and all three make this knowledge accessible in a way the previous generation of finance advice never did.
Connect with Jennifer
She Reads She Leads

Download Jennifer's free resource: the three best books across six business categories — personal finance, wealth building, networking, outsourcing, and more.
Join the She Reads She Leads Book Club for ongoing conversation between monthly Zoom sessions.
Work with Serena Low
I work with quiet women leaders in loud corporate spaces that reward extroversion. For trauma-informed guidance on how to be visible and get the recognition you deserve without depleting or draining yourself, visitserenalow.com.au.
Enjoyed this episode?
Leave a review on your listening app so more introverts can find The Quiet Warrior Podcast.

Work with Serena Low at serenalow.com.au. 
Loved this episode? Leave a review to help other Quiet Warriors find the show.
This episode was edited by Aura House Productions

What does it look like to build a life and a business  with purpose - when time is finite?
James Lang is the Managing Partner of OverLang Venture Partners, a venture firm building proprietary AI infrastructure that accelerates company growth while protecting the human capital inside each organisation. Before that, James served as COO of a medtech startup where he grew revenue past $20 million and built a team of 60 from the ground up. He's a self-described introvert, a late-diagnosed autistic, and someone navigating a serious health condition — with remarkable clarity and candour about what truly matters.
This conversation is raw, honest, and unexpectedly profound. James shares what a military upbringing and chronic illness taught him about pushing forward — not through willpower alone, but through the people you choose to bring with you. We talk about chosen family, legacy, and why the most powerful career move you can make is becoming someone who genuinely shows up for others. We also dig into AI — not the hype, but a harder question.
Key Learnings:
Why James believes the greatest competitive edge an introvert has is caring more than anyone else in the room
What it means to be a "magnet" for good people — and how to build your chosen family intentionally
Navigating serious health challenges without losing sight of purpose or progress
How James discovered late in life that he is on the autism spectrum — and what shifted when he did
The philosophy behind OverLang's approach to AI: building technology that reflects and enhances our humanity rather than replacing it
Why legacy isn't about the dollars — it's about who you took with you
If AI is built in our image, whose image is that, and what does it mean for the rest of us?

If you've ever felt like your quiet nature was holding you back, or wondered whether your careful, deep way of doing things is actually your greatest strength — this episode is for you.
Enjoyed this episode?
Leave a review on your listening app so more introverts can find The Quiet Warrior Podcast.

Connect with James Lang
Connect with James Lang
Overlang Venture Partners 

Work with Serena Low
For trauma-informed guidance on how to be a visible introvert at work without depleting or draining yourself, visitserenalow.com.au.

Work with Serena Low at serenalow.com.au. 
Loved this episode? Leave a review to help other Quiet Warriors find the show.
This episode was edited by Aura House Productions

If you've ever been told to "be more strategic" with no explanation of what that actually means — this episode is for you.
Limor Bergman Gross spent 20+ years leading engineering organisations across continents before making the leap to executive leadership herself. Now she coaches ambitious women in tech to do the same. In this conversation, she gets real about the patterns that keep talented women stuck — people-pleasing, hiding achievements, staying rigidly inside their job description — and shares the practical strategies that actually work.
We also dig into what it looks like to expand (not just "break out of") your comfort zone, how to say no without using the word no, and why protecting your time and energy isn't selfish — it's strategic. Whether you're climbing toward a promotion or trying to lead more sustainably, there's something here for you.

Key Topics 
How Limor broke through from first-line manager to executive — and what "be more strategic" really means
Introverts, permission-seeking, and taking initiative without going rogue
Expanding vs. "stepping outside" your comfort zone: – the reframe  
Why you should say yes first and figure it out later
What leaders can do to create inclusive spaces for quiet people 
Patterns Limor sees holding women in tech back — and how to shift them
How to say no without the word "no" — a practical script
Why overcommitting is bad for your employer too
It's not just how much you do — it's what you do and the impact it creates
Limor's closing message to every introvert

About Limor Bergman Gross
Limor is a former Director of Engineering with 20+ years in tech, having led engineering teams across continents. She now coaches ambitious women in tech into leadership roles and speaks globally on leadership, influence, and visibility. She is also the host of the From a Woman to a Leader podcast.
🔗 Connect with Limor on LinkedIn 🎙️ From a Woman to a Leader podcast

Enjoyed this episode?
Leave a review on your listening app.
For Serena’s guidance on how to be a Visible Introvert without performing extroversion, visit serenalow.com.au.
Work with Serena Low at serenalow.com.au. 
Loved this episode? Leave a review to help other Quiet Warriors find the show.
This episode was edited by Aura House Productions